Why serpentine? - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

TugOwar · 01-09-2005, 10:23 PM

I see alot of guys here upgrading to serpentine belt setup.
Is it just an asthetic upgrade so the engine bay looks more modern or is there performance to be gained by the upgrade? I'm curious.

Longhorn Man · 01-09-2005, 10:26 PM

PROs
A couple ponies can be gained
the belts last 75,000 miles or so
in some ways they are easier to work on

CONs
Ugly
kinda expensive
need later model reverse rotation water pump
metric fittings on some of the accesories

cableguy0 · 01-09-2005, 10:27 PM

serpentine systems are self adjusting last a lot longer and dont shred apart at higher rpms like v belts do. my truck eats a v belt every 6 or 8000 miles but it sees 6000rpm++ a lot.but no maintenance is the best reason for using a serp belt and you dont gotta replace it for 60k miles

JayDubBlazer · 01-09-2005, 10:28 PM

I doing it so I can swith over to a newer alternator (i know I don't need serpentine to do this). The belts are autpmatically tensioned, and though I am younger than many of the people on the board I have never seen a serpentine belt fray opposed to a v-belt. But mostly to do something a bit different and clean up my engine compartment

TugOwar · 01-10-2005, 12:12 AM

Interesting

Thanks for the replies.

Peregrine · 01-10-2005, 02:35 AM

We like shiny things.

*1972C10* · 01-10-2005, 05:54 AM

Ive got a Serpentine Setup For My 85 But Its Steel Brackets I Like The Brackets I Have Mainly Due To The Fact That It Puts The A/C Comp On The Passenger Side Vs. Being On The Drives Side Like It Came Factory Makes More Sense To Me TO Have The Compressor Closer To The Lines And Is Alot Cleaner IMO

One Thing About The V Belts Is If One Comes Apart Chances Are You Still Have One Spinning The Water Pump.

Tx Firefighter · 01-10-2005, 08:14 AM

The belts are much wider on a serpentine setup, so they are not going to slip as easy, so they actually have less tension on the belt which is much easier on the accesories. It's more efficient because of less friction.

mrein3 · 01-10-2005, 09:16 AM

Talk to an old school guy. They think switching to a serpentine system is nuts. Their theory is that if your AC compressor freezes up you can't just cut the belt and keep on driving.

Good theory however in 20+ years of driving ac equipped cars I've never had a compressor seize.

TugOwar · 01-10-2005, 10:12 AM

Seems theres a couple different schools of thought here, I guess I lean toward old school for the reasons already mentioned. But I can see less tension on componants as a definate benefit.

I have had a compressor go bad, didn't seize up but the clutch started coming apart. Two minutes and a pocket knife later we were back on the road. I knew a guy in high school that lost a belt in the middle of no where, used a pair of pantyhose to make a belt and get home. Hey whatever works right?

ksamps01 · 01-10-2005, 10:58 AM

Ok. Now why was he wearing Pantyhose.

dallas71 · 01-10-2005, 11:05 AM

"serpentine systems are self adjusting last a lot longer and dont shred apart at higher rpms like v belts do". This statement always amazed me seeing that NASCAR still runs a v-belt and they are running 8-9k rpm all of the time....oh well to each his own

doc_rock · 01-10-2005, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dallas71

"serpentine systems are self adjusting last a lot longer and dont shred apart at higher rpms like v belts do". This statement always amazed me seeing that NASCAR still runs a v-belt and they are running 8-9k rpm all of the time....oh well to each his own

yeah, and if we changed our belts weekly, they wouldn't shred apart at higher RPM's either.

cableguy0 · 01-10-2005, 05:48 PM

gee NASCAR uses them thats wonderful but they are driving 500 miles and then changing the belts nothing matters they have deep @ss pockets so when the unbelieveably tight belt takes out the alternator bearing it doesnt matter because it never runs long enough with that part on it to wear it. on a street driven car serpentine is the best theres no way around it. if v belts are so great why did every auto manufacturer in the world switch to serpentine systems

cableguy0 · 01-10-2005, 05:49 PM

and the main reason the "old" guys worry about the ac compressor seizing up is because the old ones didnt run for 3/4's of the year anything relatively newer gets cycled everytime the defrost comes on to stop the clutch from locking up and keep everything in good working order

JayDubBlazer · 01-10-2005, 02:35 PM

when I finally get my serpitine set up done I will make sure I have an extra belts that doesnt need to go around the compressor just in case it does seize up.

Tx Firefighter · 01-10-2005, 02:46 PM

Take it from someone who worked at a dealership. Alternators seize up about 100 times as often as AC compressors on late model GM vehicles.

Tx Firefighter · 01-10-2005, 05:51 PM

Easy there fellows. Don't make me stop this car and seperate you.

cableguy0 · 01-10-2005, 05:52 PM

lol sorry dad

DirtyLarry · 01-10-2005, 11:19 PM

I will take serpentine any day. I have converted my 78 K10 to serpentine twice….once when it had a small block and again when I swapped in the big block. I plan to do it on my 68' GMC as well.

A lot of people worry about the A/C compressor locking up and wiping the belt out. Well, if the A/C compressor does lock up, you very well may loose a serpentine belt but if the months and weeks of very audible bearing noise before the lock up did not get your attention then maybe sitting on the side of the road is well deserved.

The newer model A/C compressor the more reliable they are. The 88’ – 95’ R4 compressors were the worst (compressor in my the first pic), but will still gave you plenty of warning before they totally lock up. The later A/C compressors are 100% more reliable. (compressor in the second pic)

With serpentine you will get the minimum of 105 AMP alternator compared to a 63 AMP stock alternator for a pre-87 truck. The BB that I swapped in last summer runs 2000 model year L29 454 brackets and accessories with a 124 AMP alternator.

I personally think the serpentine system gives a much cleaner appearance than V belts, give a cool whistle noise at higher RPM’s and allows for a much more efficient A/C compressor and alternator….but like anything…everybody has their own opinion. Some people on this board still think breaker ignition and carburetors are the way to go to…..so go figure.

70 shorty · 01-10-2005, 11:38 PM

mrein, I've had one sieze up, and I did exactly what you said, cut the belt. However, that was about 15 years ago and it woud'nt stop me from putting a serpentine belt system on if I wanted to in the first place.

mrein3 · 01-12-2005, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 70 shorty

mrein, I've had one sieze up, and I did exactly what you said, cut the belt. However, that was about 15 years ago and it woud'nt stop me from putting a serpentine belt system on if I wanted to in the first place.

I wasn't knocking it. I was just pointing out what the old timers say about them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cableguy0

and the main reason the "old" guys worry about the ac compressor seizing up is because the old ones didnt run for 3/4's of the year anything relatively newer gets cycled everytime the defrost comes on to stop the clutch from locking up and keep everything in good working order

You'll notice on older vehicles to get to defrost (winter time setting) you have to go by the AC part of your controller. This I believe was an attempt to address the fact that compressors don't run much in the winter. My two Chevelles (both with AC) have "de-ice" and "defog". De-ice runs the compressor to dehumidify the air which is blended with air off the heater core. This is the main reason why I'm putting AC in my truck. So I can keep the windows clear when it is damp.

And for the record:
I am NOT in the market for a serpentine set-up for my engine. But not because I'm worried about a component seizing up. I'm just going for the stock look under my hood.

doc_rock · 01-11-2005, 12:53 PM

ya know, at least 91-94, the Chevrolet serpentine belt system would still drive the alternator, power steering pump, water pump, smog pump, and everything else on the front of the engine even if the A/C wasn't in the loop. It wasn't very tight, and it would squeal at high RPMs, but more than enough to get you home. I lost two of 'em, and both times I followed the underhood diagram for running it without an A/C compressor. it was a bit loose, but it was enough to make it home. (once in a 91 -10, once in a 94 suburban)

I agree with Dirty Larry, though. If you listen to the bearings whine for that long, you deserve (as I did) to be walking.

Purs · 01-11-2005, 03:30 PM

I don't think it's ugly, but that's just my opinion. (Yes, I know it's not a TRUE serpentine setup.)

DirtyLarry · 01-11-2005, 05:00 PM

I don’t think serpentine is ugly either. It looks much cleaner to me.

Purs, you don’t have a serpentine system. You have a V-belt system running a late 80's multi-groove belt….still look good though.

01-09-2005, 10:23 PM	#1
TugOwar Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Pleasanton, TX Posts: 1,723	Why serpentine? I see alot of guys here upgrading to serpentine belt setup. Is it just an asthetic upgrade so the engine bay looks more modern or is there performance to be gained by the upgrade? I'm curious.

01-09-2005, 10:27 PM	#3
cableguy0 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Delta,Pa Posts: 14,948	serpentine systems are self adjusting last a lot longer and dont shred apart at higher rpms like v belts do. my truck eats a v belt every 6 or 8000 miles but it sees 6000rpm++ a lot.but no maintenance is the best reason for using a serp belt and you dont gotta replace it for 60k miles __________________ Owner of North Point Car Care in Dundalk Md. We specialize in custom exhaust on both modern and classic vehicles. We are a full service auto shop from classics to modern vehicles. Feel free to contact me with questions. I will give a 10% discount to any board member.

01-09-2005, 10:28 PM	#4
JayDubBlazer go cyclones Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ames, IA Posts: 1,883	I doing it so I can swith over to a newer alternator (i know I don't need serpentine to do this). The belts are autpmatically tensioned, and though I am younger than many of the people on the board I have never seen a serpentine belt fray opposed to a v-belt. But mostly to do something a bit different and clean up my engine compartment __________________ Wes PROJECT OLE GREEN 1972 Blazer 4X4 350/700R4 2017 Silverado LT

01-10-2005, 02:35 AM	#6
Peregrine Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Louisville, Ky Posts: 329	We like shiny things. __________________ Brian 72 C10 longbed 350/th400 Let the world change you and you will change the world.

01-10-2005, 05:54 AM	#7
1972C10 Account Suspended Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 2,686	Ive got a Serpentine Setup For My 85 But Its Steel Brackets I Like The Brackets I Have Mainly Due To The Fact That It Puts The A/C Comp On The Passenger Side Vs. Being On The Drives Side Like It Came Factory Makes More Sense To Me TO Have The Compressor Closer To The Lines And Is Alot Cleaner IMO One Thing About The V Belts Is If One Comes Apart Chances Are You Still Have One Spinning The Water Pump. Last edited by 1972C10; 01-10-2005 at 05:57 AM.

01-09-2005, 10:26 PM	#2
Longhorn Man its all about the +6 inches Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Hilliard Ohio Posts: 2,690	PROs A couple ponies can be gained the belts last 75,000 miles or so in some ways they are easier to work on CONs Ugly kinda expensive need later model reverse rotation water pump metric fittings on some of the accesories

01-10-2005, 12:12 AM	#5
TugOwar Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Pleasanton, TX Posts: 1,723	Interesting Thanks for the replies.

01-10-2005, 08:14 AM	#8
Tx Firefighter Watch out for your cornhole ! Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Azle, Texas Posts: 14,162	The belts are much wider on a serpentine setup, so they are not going to slip as easy, so they actually have less tension on the belt which is much easier on the accesories. It's more efficient because of less friction. __________________ I'm on the Instagram- @Gearhead_Kevin

01-10-2005, 09:16 AM	#9
mrein3 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Center City, MN, USA Posts: 3,254	Talk to an old school guy. They think switching to a serpentine system is nuts. Their theory is that if your AC compressor freezes up you can't just cut the belt and keep on driving. Good theory however in 20+ years of driving ac equipped cars I've never had a compressor seize. __________________ '70 cab, '71 chassis, 383, TH350, NP205. '71 Malibu convertible '72 Malibu hard top Center City, MN

01-10-2005, 10:12 AM	#10
TugOwar Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Pleasanton, TX Posts: 1,723	Seems theres a couple different schools of thought here, I guess I lean toward old school for the reasons already mentioned. But I can see less tension on componants as a definate benefit. I have had a compressor go bad, didn't seize up but the clutch started coming apart. Two minutes and a pocket knife later we were back on the road. I knew a guy in high school that lost a belt in the middle of no where, used a pair of pantyhose to make a belt and get home. Hey whatever works right?

01-10-2005, 10:58 AM	#11
ksamps01 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Farmersville, TX - Northeast of Dallas Posts: 56	Ok. Now why was he wearing Pantyhose. __________________ 1967 Chevy LWB Fleetside 350/400 (Worn Smooth Out) Resto in progress It may be ugly but at least it's slow!!

01-10-2005, 11:05 AM	#12
dallas71 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Corinth,TX Posts: 444	"serpentine systems are self adjusting last a lot longer and dont shred apart at higher rpms like v belts do". This statement always amazed me seeing that NASCAR still runs a v-belt and they are running 8-9k rpm all of the time....oh well to each his own __________________ My 1966 LWB Truck My 1966 SWB Truck

01-10-2005, 05:48 PM	#14
cableguy0 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Delta,Pa Posts: 14,948	gee NASCAR uses them thats wonderful but they are driving 500 miles and then changing the belts nothing matters they have deep @ss pockets so when the unbelieveably tight belt takes out the alternator bearing it doesnt matter because it never runs long enough with that part on it to wear it. on a street driven car serpentine is the best theres no way around it. if v belts are so great why did every auto manufacturer in the world switch to serpentine systems __________________ Owner of North Point Car Care in Dundalk Md. We specialize in custom exhaust on both modern and classic vehicles. We are a full service auto shop from classics to modern vehicles. Feel free to contact me with questions. I will give a 10% discount to any board member.

01-10-2005, 05:49 PM	#15
cableguy0 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Delta,Pa Posts: 14,948	and the main reason the "old" guys worry about the ac compressor seizing up is because the old ones didnt run for 3/4's of the year anything relatively newer gets cycled everytime the defrost comes on to stop the clutch from locking up and keep everything in good working order __________________ Owner of North Point Car Care in Dundalk Md. We specialize in custom exhaust on both modern and classic vehicles. We are a full service auto shop from classics to modern vehicles. Feel free to contact me with questions. I will give a 10% discount to any board member.

01-10-2005, 02:35 PM	#16
JayDubBlazer go cyclones Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ames, IA Posts: 1,883	when I finally get my serpitine set up done I will make sure I have an extra belts that doesnt need to go around the compressor just in case it does seize up. __________________ Wes PROJECT OLE GREEN 1972 Blazer 4X4 350/700R4 2017 Silverado LT



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01-10-2005, 02:46 PM	#17
Tx Firefighter Watch out for your cornhole ! Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Azle, Texas Posts: 14,162	Take it from someone who worked at a dealership. Alternators seize up about 100 times as often as AC compressors on late model GM vehicles. __________________ I'm on the Instagram- @Gearhead_Kevin

01-10-2005, 05:51 PM	#18
Tx Firefighter Watch out for your cornhole ! Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Azle, Texas Posts: 14,162	Easy there fellows. Don't make me stop this car and seperate you. __________________ I'm on the Instagram- @Gearhead_Kevin

01-10-2005, 05:52 PM	#19
cableguy0 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Delta,Pa Posts: 14,948	lol sorry dad __________________ Owner of North Point Car Care in Dundalk Md. We specialize in custom exhaust on both modern and classic vehicles. We are a full service auto shop from classics to modern vehicles. Feel free to contact me with questions. I will give a 10% discount to any board member.

01-10-2005, 11:19 PM	#20
DirtyLarry Windy Corner of a Dirty Street Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Pueblo West, Colorado Posts: 2,926	I will take serpentine any day. I have converted my 78 K10 to serpentine twice….once when it had a small block and again when I swapped in the big block. I plan to do it on my 68' GMC as well. A lot of people worry about the A/C compressor locking up and wiping the belt out. Well, if the A/C compressor does lock up, you very well may loose a serpentine belt but if the months and weeks of very audible bearing noise before the lock up did not get your attention then maybe sitting on the side of the road is well deserved. The newer model A/C compressor the more reliable they are. The 88’ – 95’ R4 compressors were the worst (compressor in my the first pic), but will still gave you plenty of warning before they totally lock up. The later A/C compressors are 100% more reliable. (compressor in the second pic) With serpentine you will get the minimum of 105 AMP alternator compared to a 63 AMP stock alternator for a pre-87 truck. The BB that I swapped in last summer runs 2000 model year L29 454 brackets and accessories with a 124 AMP alternator. I personally think the serpentine system gives a much cleaner appearance than V belts, give a cool whistle noise at higher RPM’s and allows for a much more efficient A/C compressor and alternator….but like anything…everybody has their own opinion. Some people on this board still think breaker ignition and carburetors are the way to go to…..so go figure. Attached Images __________________ Current vehicle collection: 1978 Chevrolet K10, 8.1L, NV4500, NP205 1989 Chevrolet Suburban, 8.1L, NV4500, NP241 1993 Chevrolet C1500 Sportside, TBI 7.4L, 4L60E 2001 Chevrolet K2500HD, Ext Cab, SWB, 8.1L, ZF 6 speed 2014 Chevrolet Impala LTZ 3.6L Vortec 8.1L because life is too short to tolerate underpowered vehicles Instagram Last edited by DirtyLarry; 01-10-2005 at 11:35 PM.

01-10-2005, 11:38 PM	#21
70 shorty Where's my beer? Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Glen Allen, VA Posts: 1,772	mrein, I've had one sieze up, and I did exactly what you said, cut the belt. However, that was about 15 years ago and it woud'nt stop me from putting a serpentine belt system on if I wanted to in the first place. __________________ 70 C10, shortstep, .30 over 250,Hurst shifted 3 spd parts hauler. Holley 390, Clifford Intake, Header, ported cylinder head, unknown bigger cam. 79 Corvette L82, 4 spd, black, red interior, headers, flowmasters, and unkown bigger cam. '03 Grand Cherokee Laredo, 4.0 4x4 daily driver. 165K miles, and runs great '08 Tahoe LTZ 4x4 155K

01-11-2005, 12:53 PM	#23
doc_rock Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 84	ya know, at least 91-94, the Chevrolet serpentine belt system would still drive the alternator, power steering pump, water pump, smog pump, and everything else on the front of the engine even if the A/C wasn't in the loop. It wasn't very tight, and it would squeal at high RPMs, but more than enough to get you home. I lost two of 'em, and both times I followed the underhood diagram for running it without an A/C compressor. it was a bit loose, but it was enough to make it home. (once in a 91 -10, once in a 94 suburban) I agree with Dirty Larry, though. If you listen to the bearings whine for that long, you deserve (as I did) to be walking. __________________ 1969 Chevrolet C-10 Bananamobile. Yes, it's ugly, yes, it's rusty, it's slow too, but no, I'm not trying to show it.

01-11-2005, 03:30 PM	#24
Purs Got Big Block? Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: West Texas Posts: 1,510	I don't think it's ugly, but that's just my opinion. (Yes, I know it's not a TRUE serpentine setup.) Attached Images __________________ "Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted." Last edited by Purs; 01-11-2005 at 03:41 PM.

01-11-2005, 05:00 PM	#25
DirtyLarry Windy Corner of a Dirty Street Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Pueblo West, Colorado Posts: 2,926	I don’t think serpentine is ugly either. It looks much cleaner to me. Purs, you don’t have a serpentine system. You have a V-belt system running a late 80's multi-groove belt….still look good though. __________________ Current vehicle collection: 1978 Chevrolet K10, 8.1L, NV4500, NP205 1989 Chevrolet Suburban, 8.1L, NV4500, NP241 1993 Chevrolet C1500 Sportside, TBI 7.4L, 4L60E 2001 Chevrolet K2500HD, Ext Cab, SWB, 8.1L, ZF 6 speed 2014 Chevrolet Impala LTZ 3.6L Vortec 8.1L because life is too short to tolerate underpowered vehicles Instagram

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