Is ecm tuning worth it?

[OKGMC4]

On a fairly stock 5.3 engine isn't there really only about 15hp difference? Or is there a lot that goes into the trans settings and under the peak hp that make a huge difference? It's hard for me to dump a bunch of cash into it when I'm not sure the change will be worth it. Mail in tunes like blackbear are cheaper but wouldn't be as accurate as a local guy that does it with a wide band...he wants $550 and says I will have to leave it for a week at his house, and that seems really excessive. I know the tune is critical if you have done serious mods but mine is basically stock except a custom air cleaner and free flowing exhaust. Has anyone done this and give a thumbs up or down?

[BR3W CITY]

ECM tuning is probably the SINGLE best thing you can do to any modable car made post 1996. Why?

Aside from the fact that you already need some tuning to remove VATS and emissions, ECM tuning manipulates much more than may be obvious. There are things like changing knock count settings, lockup RPM etc that change the way the truck FEELS, not just hp numbers. The other reason has more to do with the tuner; Your guy sounds like kind of a pain to deal with, and that price is painful.

My tuner has been a relationship, included in the price. He came to my house at 8am on my startup day, so we could remove vats and test the TAC and get an idle established with my Tsunami cam. After that, I went out to their shop for my dyno tune; I was told it would include 3 pulls (they don't charge by the hour unless you need labor on the truck). The tuner and shop guys (3) worked on my truck for over an hour and a half and four pulls. I paid about $380, and that included welding 02 bungs into my exhaust for wideband.
To go even further, I was having some lockup problems and had switched tire sizes; the tuner met me again and we road tested the truck making all needed changes. Grand total? The gas to get there....all touchups on the tune were included if he didn't get it right the first time. Maybe I got a little lucky, it all fell into place well...but still its one of the best customer service experience I ever had.

[farmtrucks]

The guy I had do mine charged 300.00. We done road test as he tuned. My engine is stock. After he tuned it -- it felt like a totally different truck. Before, the truck didn't pull hard in the higher RPM's. After, the truck pulls harder and feels MUCH stronger, he also raised my shift points. I dont have any stats before the tune, but I averaged 24 MPG on a 600 mile trip to a Goodguys shows. I feel like it was the best $300.00 I spent. I'm doing a 66 suburban now, and it is definately getting a tune.

[sunk99]

Originally Posted by farmtrucks

The guy I had do mine charged 300.00. We done road test as he tuned. My engine is stock. After he tuned it -- it felt like a totally different truck. Before, the truck didn't pull hard in the higher RPM's. After, the truck pulls harder and feels MUCH stronger, he also raised my shift points. I dont have any stats before the tune, but I averaged 24 MPG on a 600 mile trip to a Goodguys shows. I feel like it was the best $300.00 I spent. I'm doing a 66 suburban now, and it is definately getting a tune.

If you don't mind me asking, could you tell me who you used for tuning? I am getting ready to drop the 5.3 into my burb and will need someone to do a tune because I am changing my cam and adding a stall converter. Thanks

[farmtrucks]

Originally Posted by sunk99

If you don't mind me asking, could you tell me who you used for tuning? I am getting ready to drop the 5.3 into my burb and will need someone to do a tune because I am changing my cam and adding a stall converter. Thanks

Tony Roberts, in Rutledge. works at his dad's parts store.(Doyles Auto Parts 865-828-4141) They do Hi-performance applications for vettes and camaros to. Tell him Ferguson brothers sent you...

[sunk99]

Originally Posted by farmtrucks

Tony Roberts, in Rutledge. works at his dad's parts store.(Doyles Auto Parts 865-828-4141) They do Hi-performance applications for vettes and camaros to. Tell him Ferguson brothers sent you...

OK thanks
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[Thealien]

I have a great local tuner. No dyno pulls or wideband but he did drive my truck and did the tuning live on the fly. He also did my O2 and VATS deletes, eliminated torque management. He even loaded my tune onto a spare ECM I had so if I ever had a problem I could swap in my spare ECM and eliminate that as an issue. All for about $175 I couldn't be happier.

[Jon01]

OP - Yes, get a tune. Like previously stated you'll need one to disable VATS.

Originally Posted by Thealien

I have a great local tuner. No dyno pulls or wideband but he did drive my truck and did the tuning live on the fly. He also did my O2 and VATS deletes, eliminated torque management. He even loaded my tune onto a spare ECM I had so if I ever had a problem I could swap in my spare ECM and eliminate that as an issue. All for about $175 I couldn't be happier.

If he did all of this without a wideband I would suggest you get a new tune and tuner.
Gutting tq mag't is not a good idea.
Cheaper is not always better when it comes to tuners, a bad tune can cost you a motor and/or trans.

[OKGMC4]

Originally Posted by Jon01

OP - Yes, get a tune. Like previously stated you'll need one to disable VATS.



If he did all of this without a wideband I would suggest you get a new tune and tuner.
Gutting tq mag't is not a good idea.
Cheaper is not always better when it comes to tuners, a bad tune can cost you a motor and/or trans.

I've heard people say yes to tq mgmnt and others say no. Seems like gm went to a ton of trouble to make sure we don't break our cars, especially the weak 4l60e, by taking out a bunch of timing at full throttle and during shifts. Is this correct? Seems like I don't really need it and if I break it, that's my own fault and means I need to build the tranny stronger. The guy that programmed mine does these as a street rod basis only...delete egr and vats, unlimited rpm and no speed limiter, and tq mgmnt delete. When I asked about performance tunes and shift changes and he said no, to rule out custom setups for every car. Stock engines only, and it was mail order. I had no ecm at the time and it got me running but now I would like some more...

Reason why...I have a free flow air box and much better than stock exhaust, and put in a slightly better ls1 camaro cam for $25. I figured it comes in the LS327 crate engine that has 325hp so what the heck, only cost $25. In theory these 3 things should make me slightly faster than a stock 5.3l. My co worker has an all stock 2004 silverado and we run nose and nose. He's heavier but has more gear and it evens out. It just seems to reason that I havn't made the best advantage out of the changes and the ecm needs to match. It runs so pig rich you can smell the unburnt fuel at the tailpipe. I guess my problem was the uncertainty of the outcome of a tune and the fact that the only local guy I've heard any good about is stupid high. But, then again, if it's done right with a wide band and double checked for accuracy I could see how it would be time consuming and time means more cash.

[Thealien]

Yeah Ok Here is his website. He didnt tune for high performance but I'll tell you the driveability, dependability, and reliability have been fantastic.He is not some backyard tuner with a laptop either. Here is his website, I think I;ll stick with him thanks!

http://slowhawkperformance.com/

Originally Posted by Jon01

OP - Yes, get a tune. Like previously stated you'll need one to disable VATS.



If he did all of this without a wideband I would suggest you get a new tune and tuner.
Gutting tq mag't is not a good idea.
Cheaper is not always better when it comes to tuners, a bad tune can cost you a motor and/or trans.

[bohmankid]

I haven't tuned my 5.3 yet but plan to eventually.
A buddy of mine had his 2000 ls1 camaro tuned by a local performance shop. He put some bolt ons onto the car first (headers, exhaust, ls6 manifold, etc.). He gained over 40HP after the tune. Previously 300hp and finished with 350hp (uncorrected for elevation) from the dyno tune. He also previously ran a 14.6 in the quarter mile and bumped that down to 13.7 (utah elevation 4200 ft.). cost him around $320 and discounts off future tunes.
Definitely sounds worth it to me.

[68GMCCustom]

Ed Wright is one of the "original" GM tuners....going WAY back.

Close by too....

http://www.fastchip.com/

[OKGMC4]

Originally Posted by 68GMCCustom

Ed Wright is one of the "original" GM tuners....going WAY back.

Close by too....

http://www.fastchip.com/

He's just as high on custom tunes and I've heard alot of bad about him on the internet. Doesn't really mean anything, I don't know him personally, but he sure gets short with his nay sayers on the forums. I actually have one of his chips in my 92 Firebird. To be honest I never noticed a real difference with that chip other than it pings when you use less than 91 octane in it. That's why I'm so unsure about doing it in the GMC. That whole fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me thing...but it sounds like LS engine REALLY wake up with it.

[68GMCCustom]

Interesting. I've never used him, but knew some about his history and that he was in your area.

I bought HPTuners from my tuner (in TX) so that I could email logs and he could email me knew tunes. I figure by the time he gets my TBSS tuned also...I'll have enough files to look back over to possibly tune the next one myself.

[Jon01]

Originally Posted by 68GMCCustom

Interesting. I've never used him, but knew some about his history and that he was in your area.

I bought HPTuners from my tuner (in TX) so that I could email logs and he could email me knew tunes. I figure by the time he gets my TBSS tuned also...I'll have enough files to look back over to possibly tune the next one myself.

There is a FANTASTIC TBSS tune in the HPT repository. I can't remember who did it but I adopted most of the changes into my wife's old one and it really woke it up. Whole new vehicle and got better mileage to boot.
I'd strongly suggest giving it a look. I used it about 5 years ago when we had hers and I can't for the life of me remember who put it up there.

[BR3W CITY]

From what I understand, torque management is more complex than just a "check box" in a tuning program. Although it can be completely disabled, it makes changes in fuel and timing that will remain if they aren't corrected after tq management is disabled (or in many cases now, just turned down, but still left to function....this does let you do burnouts and launches, without the obvious bogging it causes. A mail order tune can only turn it flat off, which is not necessarily the best from a performance standpoint. Tq management is also something that you don't realize until you don't have it....it can help make a fairly radical car a bit less awkward to drive in street traffic....i.e. you can accel to pass without always blowing tires loose if you give it a little much juice.

[Jon01]

Kind of.
TM only comes into play during shifts. It works by closing throttle, pulling timing or a combination of both to prolong trans life.
It's become much more prevalent as HP and vehicle weight has gone up over the last 5-6 years.

Killing it in a heavy vehicle with a lot of HP will have a significant negative impact on transmission life and is NOT a good idea.

[68GMCCustom]

I'll have to check the repository out. I think I had to create an online account...just haven't gotten to it.

As far as TM....in my case its disabled since the truck will be raced, and its been upgraded to a 4L85e. When I ran the carb setup there was no TM for the 200-4r...and with the 4L85e now I'm thinking it doesn't need it anyway. If I do break it....I'll just get it built to handle even more.
Now on my TBSS I won't be disabling it...maybe turn it down some. The 4L70e they have STILL isn't enough.