Need advice about keeping original motor and transmission

[Old&Slow]

The wife and I are in the process of retro-modding a 59 GMC that her father had since the early 70’s. It has lots of sentimental value to her since she grew up with the truck in the family and even more after her father passed away about 10 years ago. Her father would garage the truck during the winter and it was kept in the garage since he passed away.

We are setting it up as a reliable casual driver with the potential to tow a retro camper. We are installing a V8, auto trans, power steering, power disc brakes, etc. and have decide to replace the frame instead of cutting up and welding the old one. Which brings me to my question. It has the original matching numbers engine and transmission on the original frame. I was planning on storing these parts but the possibility of us converting the truck back to its original state is probably never going to happen. I was hoping someone could convince me to sell the rolling frame with the motor and transmission, instead of me storing it and never using the parts. I don’t think a matching engine and transmission, even on the original frame, have much value without the body, but would welcome any advice.

Thanks, Pete

P.S. This site has been great for restoration information, really happy I found it!

[chopit]

I agree with your assessment. Somebody out there that bought an old "field find" is probably looking to restore their truck back to original equipment and would love to have it.

If the engine/trans was the only thing you were swapping, then I might be tempted to sit the old motor/trans in the corner, but imho, you are going way to far for that. You are now officially in restomod territory.

BTW, Nice truck!

[jetnow1]

Check with your Motor vehicle dept first- remember the frame has the vin number that
the vehicle was registered with. If you sell the frame you may find you cannot register
the vehicle without going thru the whole kit car process. At minimum cut the frame
number off and weld it to the new frame.

[OrrieG]

Don't understand the "cutting frame" to add a v8, these trucks came from the factory with them and you can easily add a modern auto trans and more traveling friendly rearend. You can upgrade the original straight axle to PS and discs. Or there are many bolt on IFS systems that will upgrade the ride and preserve the frame for the future. The frame has two matching vins one on the top of the frame just in front of the steering box and a secret one on the top of the frame under the drive door step area ( challenge to read with the cab on). Starting in the 60's GM added hidden second VINs to aid in theft recovery. Myself I would keep any original parts I took off just incase your kids or grandkids want to restore it back to original, that is what I have done with my 64 Chevelle survivor.

You are luck to have such a well cared for truck I would make every effort to keep it as original as possible.

[67GMCkid]

Originally Posted by jetnow1

Check with your Motor vehicle dept first- remember the frame has the vin number that
the vehicle was registered with. If you sell the frame you may find you cannot register
the vehicle without going thru the whole kit car process. At minimum cut the frame
number off and weld it to the new frame.

I know Chevys were stamped but.
Are you certain GMC's had frame's stamped with their Vins?
I have 2 bare 67 GMC frames here and neither are stamped with a vin..

[OrrieG]

Only know about the 55-59 vin locations. Probably changed in later models.

[bajabob]

I love your old truck and personally think it would be way cooler to restore it back to original (like pops had it) and drag around the ol skool trailer. If you want a hot rod, build the frame up the way you want and then find a parts truck to grab the sheet metal you want to cut and customize. Pop's truck stay intac and you get the hot rod truck you want. You asked, thats what I would do.
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[tmoble]

IMO, if you ever want to actually drive the truck you'd be way ahead to install a modern engine transmission, and rear axle. You don't have to change the frame to do this. You can run a modern Mustang II front with power R&P, it it with disc brakes. Run a 700-4R auto overdrive trans and rear axle with a 3.23 to 3.73 gear. 3.42 is about ideal. Update the radiator. There's master cylinder kits out there that allow to run a modern dual master cylinder and small diameter multi-diaphragm power booster.

Without extensive mods the original six just isn't much good for anything that involves freeway or highway and a load. THese trucks were originally desined for farm and industrial use, 45 MPH tops over any distance. In my mis-spent youth I blew up a couple 235s putting them on the freeway at 60MPH.

[roger55]

Originally Posted by tmoble

IMO, if you ever want to actually drive the truck you'd be way ahead to install a modern engine transmission, and rear axle. You don't have to change the frame to do this. ....

I agree with you Tom.

If my goal were to pull a retro trailer, I would want the truck on the stock frame with it at stock height. Upgrade the engine and tranny just like you say and also go to front disc brakes and power steering. I think the CPP 400 steering box would be hard to beat. Very happy with mine.

Nothing wrong with a straight axle. I've driven many, many trucks of all sizes with straight axles over the years. I drove trucks for a living for 11 years. I began at just 19 years old on an 18 wheel semi.

[dwcsr]

Keep in mind that his is a GMC engine most likely 248 not a 235 and as such is an actual truck motor full oiler not the poorly designed 235 oiling system. 248 rebuilt is a very viable and reliable motor for highway driving. Were this my truck I'd leave the 248 and add a 5 speed or an 700r or leave the 4 speed just with a better gear in the back. The 248 is the motor Japan copied for their FJ Land Cruiser and used for many years with minor improvements.

[tmoble]

248 Jimmy? I didn't know of any such thing till now. Haven't had much to do with GMCs. I still think he's be better off with a modern drivetrain.

[dwcsr]

GMC of that era had 228, 248, 270 in pickups and a 302 in the larger trucks like the school buses and up, If this truck has a 270 and it may I would definitely keep it.
That the cool thing about hot rodding and resto mods the only wrong build is the one the owner didn't want.

[mr48chev]

As far as keeping the chassis for "later' I'd just prep it with some Marvel Mystery oil in the cylinders and seal off all the openings and stick it away if you want to keep it.

I don't know what frame you swapped to but from what I have seen these trucks get cut up more with a frame swap to a later frame than they do with a simple engine swap.

Still a good riding good driving truck that is easy for both of you to drive gets driven a lot more and gets to go on a lot more trips out of town to interesting places with great photo ops than most stock trucks do.

[Old&Slow]

I wanted to thank everyone that took the time to reply to my plea for help. After taking into consideration the comments made I have decide to hold onto all the parts for now. We have owned the truck for several years and have gone back and forth on what type of restoration we wanted to do. The option of restoring everything back to its original condition was on the table and favored for a while, but the more we discussed it, the more concerns we had about potential driving limits in regards to highway driving, towing and most importantly safety as my wife was planning to drive the truck as much as possible.
Some questions came up during the replies that I would like to address, and again feel free to add your opinions. I know there are some bolt on options available for the front end to upgrade the suspension and brakes, but we probably would have opted to cut and weld a new front clip on. Also with going to a V8 and upgraded drive train, we also discussed boxing in the frame. Classics Industries has an aftermarket box frame with an upgrade suspension and disc brakes that will allow the body to bolt on and that is the option we are planning. Even though we will be upgrading drive train, brakes and suspension, the goal is to have the truck look as original as possible and not hot rod it in terms of look. From an external perspective the only things that will change are the addition of shoulder belts and moving the gas tank filler nozzle to back of the rear fender. Even under the hood, we had a small block 400 that we had rebuilt with an EFI system that looks like a carbureted manifold and are installing old style exhaust manifolds and air filter for a vintage look.
I don’t ever see us converting this set up back to original, but I will keep all the original frame, drive-train and parts allowing me to install the body back onto the original setup and finding a donor body for this new setup. But for now it makes my wife feel like its still her dad’s truck and it will be safe and reliable, those are my main goals. Thanks again, I will post pictures as the project progresses.

[OrrieG]

Sounds like a good plan to get it on the road quickly. 10K sounds like a lot up front, but when you add up a front suspension, rear suspension, brakes, etc. the component costs get close enough that time to completion vs. dollars becomes moot. Check the towing capacity of the Classic frame package.

[bajabob]

LOL it is your truck and your the one writing the checks... to each their own !!!! I normally dont go around sharing my vision with others because it is just that "my vision"!!! but you did ask and well it looks like you got lots of advice (mostly free I think too ??) Anyway, what ever you build just build it to the highest quality you can muster and it will be bad ass!!!! good luck
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[_Ogre]

many of us looked at a new updated frame until we saw the price
if the money is in the budget you'll be miles ahead at the beginning of your build
and that much closer to driving it down the road

one thing to consider...
check with the frame manufacturer as to the finished ride height of the truck
most frames are designed to lower these trucks and may not sit at stock height

[Hblee]

I kept the worn out 265 from my 57. Maybe I'll find someone who needs it one day, I won't be going back original.

[Old&Slow]

Yes the frame is pricey, but I am having a shop do the restoration. The price of having them do the upgrades and box in the frame is not a big difference compared to the new frame. I wish I had half the skills (and tools) that some of the folks on this forum have. I don't, so I am having to put more money into this truck then I could ever sell it for. At the end of the day I don't ever plan of seller it and if my wife is happy with the truck then life is good. I will look into the comments about trailer loads and stance of the truck with the new frame. I really appreciate all the comments and suggestions, thanks again.

[gabe2000]

I will soon start on my project and will post it. my 1956 sitting on a 1966 frame with rear trailing arm suspension/coil spring. 1990 chevy van to part out.

[Old&Slow]

AD, the frame is coming from Classic Industries. I went onto their web site and couldn't find any frames, but I didn't search too long either. If you are interested in details I can ask the shop any specific you want to know.

[Advanced Design]

Great back story on the truck! A keeper for sure. Do you have a link to the chassis you are considering?