right truck, wrong motor..."ls" 5.3 vs 350 TPI

[hotcorner216]

Been looking for a swb c10 with a 5.3l to make my daily...the finished ones ive seen have been for 23k+ which is fine just havent found one i like enough to pull the trigger on...i was originally going to build it, which i might but i already have a project chevelle so id like something at least drivable with a 5.3 already in it....anyway...i found the right truck, color combo, wheels, interior, even has working AC...but it has 350TPI, i dont know much about the tpi...i know its similar to the vortec as far as the block...really wanted a 5.3l to get into the high 300hp/low 400hp mark...is that hp range realistic for a streetable, daily drive in a tpi? What do i have to change? I know its kind of all over but Thanks!

[leftybass209]

Are you looking to hit a horsepower number, or the added benefits of an ls motor? If it were me I'd hold out for a truck with a transplanted ls. That's the only way to take advantage of the MPG's and cost of the swap in general.

[hotcorner216]

Benefits of an ls motor....itll be a daily so mpg is important too...not looking for 30mpg obviously but id like to be 20s highway

[MARKDTN]

TPI can go into the low 300HP with some mods. Vortec heads and special intake get 350.

https://sdparts.com/details/scoggin-...-center/sd3816

The TPI runners won't support high rpm and high flow. About 5000-5500rpm is a high limit for a 350 with stock runners. Even less for a 383. I have 2 running and like them very much. TPI is a great torque engine in stock form. To get 400+HP you have to do heads, ported intake, aftermarket larger runners, aftermarket or ported plenum, bigger throttle body, bigger injectors, etc. Depends on what you want. If you can live with 300-350 reliable HP, then TPI is great. If you really need over 400HP, then wait for an LS.

[67ChevyRedneck]

Originally Posted by hotcorner216

Benefits of an ls motor....itll be a daily so mpg is important too...not looking for 30mpg obviously but id like to be 20s highway

That's a little optimistic.

Expect something like 13-14mpg "city" and 17-18 highway... with maybe 20 if you tune it right with the right gearing.

Add another 100HP and drop those numbers a mpg or two.

Also, you'll eventually burn up a 4L60 with 400HP. You'll want to build it up or swap it for a 4L80.

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by hotcorner216

Benefits of an ls motor....itll be a daily so mpg is important too...not looking for 30mpg obviously but id like to be 20s highway

Real world example. My '83 K20 I have had since it had 42K miles. It always got 14 city and 17 highway. It had a 350 and 700R4 transmission with 3.42 gears. I pulled the stock engine at 150k with a bad cam lobe and put in a complete stone stock aluminum head roller cam '90 Corvette TPI. I now get around 17 city and 20+ highway. The power is also noticeable. Where I was always on the gas pulling a trailer with the carb, with fuel injection it just pulls on. Without 4wd and 3/4 ton you might do better.

[Heavymetl]

Chuck the Tpi and go LS. If you have not bought an engine yet, spend the "big bucks" (~1000) for an L33 5.3L. They're a baby Ls6 and make great power with just a cam change. It'll run circles and then some around the ol' TPI.

Granted this example is in a Vette, but you get the idea of the potential here over a run of the mill sbc. http://ls1tech.com/forums/dynamomete...o-results.html

[Nitis]

If the truck was exactly what you wanted and the price was good I'd have a hard time passing it up. One thing to consider is even if you still want LS in the future you can get something out of the tpi unit as they still have value. They just aren't as sexy as an LS

You guys from the Midwest just kill me with what you claim to be picking these engines up for. Out here you can't touch any LS for under $1500 and that has 150k on it.

[Heavymetl]

Originally Posted by Nitis

You guys from the Midwest just kill me with what you claim to be picking these engines up for. Out here you can't touch any LS for under $1500 and that has 150k on it.

1500? I paid $800 for a van 4.8/4l80e complete dropout a few months back..and some told me that was steep. California....I knew you all had high cost of living but dang!

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by Nitis

... in the future you can get something out of the tpi unit as they still have value. They just aren't as sexy as an LS...

Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on how you look at it) TPI units are nowhere near what they used to bring. I have been dragging around a Corvette one complete with a good distributor, nice runners, with injectors for 3 years to swap meets. I paid $300 for it in 2002 and it was a bargain. I can't get $250 now. There was a guy at Nashville AACA this year with basically complete units for $125 and $150. I have 3 more compete ones. No idea what I will ever use them on, but I can't just dump them.

As far as sexy as an LS. IMHO no other Chevy engine has the visual appeal of a TPI except maybe an original FI unit from the 60s. The long runners make it really pop. Now if you mean that bang for the buck LS is the way to go, then I couldn't agree more.

But for a guy that has a nice 350 bottom end without a lumpy cam, TPI is a real winner. It adds low end torque and combines it with better fuel management that gives you mileage, startability, and drivability that you just can't get with a carburetor.

If you can't tell, I love TPI. It's just that LS is even better.

[Nitis]

Originally Posted by MARKDTN

Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on how you look at it) TPI units are nowhere near what they used to bring. I have been dragging around a Corvette one complete with a good distributor, nice runners, with injectors for 3 years to swap meets. I paid $300 for it in 2002 and it was a bargain. I can't get $250 now. There was a guy at Nashville AACA this year with basically complete units for $125 and $150. I have 3 more compete ones. No idea what I will ever use them on, but I can't just dump them.

As far as sexy as an LS. IMHO no other Chevy engine has the visual appeal of a TPI except maybe an original FI unit from the 60s. The long runners make it really pop. Now if you mean that bang for the buck LS is the way to go, then I couldn't agree more.

But for a guy that has a nice 350 bottom end without a lumpy cam, TPI is a real winner. It adds low end torque and combines it with better fuel management that gives you mileage, startability, and drivability that you just can't get with a carburetor.

If you can't tell, I love TPI. It's just that LS is even better.

By sexy I meant cool factor not so much eye appeal. As I agree tpi is easy on the eyes

[fourspeedwagon]

Originally Posted by Nitis

You guys from the Midwest just kill me with what you claim to be picking these engines up for. Out here you can't touch any LS for under $1500 and that has 150k on it.

I was chatting with the guy that runs a local yard. He was laughing (and amazed) about the fact he was shipping a "truck" engine - a 6.0 ls - to somebody all the way across the country and the guy had paid his asking price of $700. thought it sounded like a great deal but he's the guy in the business. Seems to be highly dependent on location.

[Nitis]

Originally Posted by fourspeedwagon

I was chatting with the guy that runs a local yard. He was laughing (and amazed) about the fact he was shipping a "truck" engine - a 6.0 ls - to somebody all the way across the county and the guy had paid his asking price of $700. thought it sounded like a great deal but he's the guy in the business. Seems to be highly dependent on location.

6.0 around here $2k minimum no trans

[Andy4639]

I swapped out my 305 TPI 700 R-4 for a LS 6.0 with 3l80e and I can't believe the differance it made and both motors are stock.

The LS motor and 4l80e hands down no questions asked is 100 times better. Stock 350 TPI may have 200 HP stock, which I doubt. A stock LS motor starts at 200 and goes up! My 6.0 put 290RWHP on the Dyno. You are way ahead of the HP game with a stock LS motor over the old small block.

[Woodnears]

I sold my tpi a week ago for 750 and bought a ls motor and tranny for 1200! The complete pullout only had 51k on it. im in the final stages of getting it run ready now. by the truck and buy a pullout off ebay to put in it. its really no that hard once you get into it.

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by Woodnears

I sold my tpi a week ago for 750 and bought a ls motor and tranny for 1200! The complete pullout only had 51k on it. im in the final stages of getting it run ready now. by the truck and buy a pullout off ebay to put in it. its really no that hard once you get into it.

This always comes up and needs to be put into perspective. I will use generic numbers to demonstrate this. You buy a 20k truck. You buy a 1500 dollar motor, that needs another 500 in parts to get it going. Now you have a 22k truck. How much in gas will you save to warrant the cost of the 2k swap you just performed? In the end, it winds up being negligible to do the swap as opposed to keeping what was already in; it was built into the cost of the truck.

ie: This is why I stated if you HAVE to have an LS.... wait for an LS equipped truck to pop up for sale that meets your needs. In the long run you save money AND benefit from the cost of the motor. If you purchase a motor separate you have to wait through quite a few thousand miles of fueling the tank before you start to see a return on your investment.

[67ChevyRedneck]

That's not necessarily true... LS trucks are demanding a premium now, meaning a higher purchase price than the same exact truck without one, so the cost could be a wash to convert one without (that doesn't mean a great deal on an LS truck couldn't pop up!)

True, the OD savings do take a long time to recover, but that's not the only reason people do the swap. They're literally zero maintenance (no points or dizzy to adjust, no carb to adjust, etc), no zinc for the oil, with Mobil 1 you can safely run 5,000 miles, the reduced rpm is great if you're trying to talk to someone going 70mph, they start up on the first hit without pumping the pedal, and they'll run for 200K+ without a rebuild.

That all said... I have a carbed 350 in my truck and no plans for an LS, but I do own a modern LS truck.

[Vintage Windmills]

Assuming you don't want more than 300hp, a late 90's vortec 350 vs a 5.3 is a wash in my opinion when you compare them. I've owned both. Both are pretty much zero maintenance and within 2mpg of each other. The 350 is a easier and cheaper swap, which IMO compensates for the slightly lower fuel economy.

[Andy4639]

I pretty much drive my 71 everyday rain or shine. The cost of install is a little higher than a small block but the benifit of the LS is way above the small block ever amagined. I don't care what anybody tries to tell you. If you thinking about a new motor install are buying a new truck are old truck, look for a LS swap truck hands down no arguing! It's that much better!

Cold starting is a big + for the LS over the old SB.
Better MPG
Better life out of the LS motor over a SB.
Less maintance on the LS compared to the SB


Everything about a LS is better than the SB.

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by hotcorner216

...i found the right truck, color combo, wheels, interior, even has working AC...but it has 350TPI, i dont know much about the tpi...i know its similar to the vortec as far as the block...

I think some are missing the point of the OP. As I understand it he wanted an LS truck but found a TPI truck. He wants to know if it is worth waiting for and paying for an LS.

If I understand OP correctly, it all depends on what you want. I say go drive the truck and decide. TPI is a low-end powerhouse. Coupled with the low gears of a 700R4 they really pull. What do you want to do with the truck? Cruise? Tow? Drag race? daily driver?......all of the above?

[67 cst swb]

Originally Posted by hotcorner216

i found the right truck, color combo, wheels, interior, even has working AC...but it has 350TPI

I would say you have found your next truck. A 350TPI is a decent daily driver. The different in MPG is not much really. Then when your current project is done, you have your next project, an LS swap into the daily driver truck. Plus, this give's you time locate and acquire the LS swap parts without having to rush into spending a bunch of $.

[Ackattack]

I had a 72 GMC that I put a TPI 350/3.73 gear/700R4 tranny. It was OK. I got OK mileage, and I had a few little buggy/idle issues with it.

When it came time to build the truck of my dreams I seriously considered building the TPI. Ultimately I built my 68 with a 5.3/4.10/4L60E. And honestly, there is no comparison. The LS engine is WAY better.

As far as fuel mileage goes, I can't really compare apples to apples since I had the TPI engine in WA where the highway speed limits are 60 compared to KS where they're 75. But I was getting 16ish in the TPI truck (may have gotten 18 once) and I get around 17ish in my 68 truck (doing 75). If it was an apples to apples comparison, I think the LS engine would get you 2-3 mpg better.