Sloppy steering, exact details?

[wilkin250r]

I'm getting ready to upgrade all the components in my steering system in an effort to fix my problem of wandering all over the road. This first go around will be all the budget fixes, which rules out a steering box rebuild/replace or crossover steering. I'll do the tie rod ends, drag link ends, spring bushings, and the rag joint (I'll probably do the jeep steering shaft fix. For those searching this in the future, the details can be found here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9C4RdvjPNQ )


So let's talk about the exact details, because this is new territory for me. Are the tie rod ends and drag link ends the same? Is there a brand or style better than another? Any issues I need to look for?

Bushings for the springs: Am I looking for rubber or polyurethane? I would imagine the poly to be harder, less likely to flex. That sounds bad and noisy for cab mounts, but I don't see a downside to spring bushings.

As it sits now, my tie rod ends are the only thing that really look "bad", but I'm going to change the other components also. I'm thinking my whole problem isn't just one thing, it's a combination of many loose tolerances and worn-out parts. I'll probably brace the frame with a bracket from Offroad Design while I'm at it, and if these issues don't fix my problem, I'll rebuild the power steering box, and maybe the knuckles.

[bilfman]

The poly bushings and tie rod ends will make a world of difference. Start there, my guess is that will set you straight from the info provided, that is if you have power steering .

[72shorbox]

Use Moog parts for your tie rod ends and ball joints, they are quality and will last

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by 72shorbox

Use Moog parts for your tie rod ends and ball joints, they are quality and will last

I couldn't agree more. Over the years I've seen problems with cheap "no name" parts, such as cracked ball joint grease boots right out of the box, improperly machined threads, and even a pair of tie rod ends that wouldn't take grease -- and no, it wasn't the zerk fittings. On the other hand, I've never had a problem with Moog parts, regardless of where they are made.

On another note, have you checked the front end alignment? Not enough caster could cause wandering, and that might also be true of not enough toe-in. I have to think that your very large tires might amplify any misalignment conditions, and may even require non-standard specs. (???)

[wilkin250r]

Tie rod ends are falling apart (first picture), but my drag link ends still look good. And not just by appearance, I don't notice any significant play in them as I move the steering back and forth. But I'll replace them anyways.

[KrazyRay]

Did you see any play at the pitman arm to the steering box? There is also an adjuster on top of the steering box if you have play in the box.

[wilkin250r]

Originally Posted by KrazyRay

Did you see any play at the pitman arm to the steering box? There is also an adjuster on top of the steering box if you have play in the box.

I don't see any play in the pitman arm. What I do see is a little bit of frame flex at the steering box, but I don't see any cracks in the frame so far.

Not only are my tires large, but my rims have something like a 2-inch backspace, they have a REALLY wide stance. All that extra leverage I'm sure is a big contributing factor to my problem. I would imagine that fixing the tie rod ends and bracing the frame with the ORD kit will fix 80% of my issue.

[mattcrp1]

Originally Posted by wilkin250r

I don't see any play in the pitman arm. What I do see is a little bit of frame flex at the steering box, but I don't see any cracks in the frame so far.

Not only are my tires large, but my rims have something like a 2-inch backspace, they have a REALLY wide stance. All that extra leverage I'm sure is a big contributing factor to my problem. I would imagine that fixing the tie rod ends and bracing the frame with the ORD kit will fix 80% of my issue.

i had to take my steering box off and found the crack in the frame, I ordered the smittybuilt frame brace that is supposed to help this. Still waiting on it so show up.

[Matt Man]

I put both the bolt in brace and welded the frame ( my frame wasn't cracked ) and the truck not only steers better, but tracks a lot better after you hit a bump on the highway. The whole front end feels way more solid now.

['68 Newtricks]

I'd pull the steering box off and check for cracks. There are tons of pictures of cracked holes or even a crack going from hole to hole, behind the box.

Find a Jeep shaft in the junkyard or get a new one from Amazon ~ $100. If you go Jeep shaft, make sure to weld the top isolater bushing solid. They tend to be super loose by the time they hit the Jyards. I wish I knew what the year break is for the Chevy columns and steering boxes. I know mid 80s stuff works

If you wheel the truck, a weld in frame brace is also a smart move. It's not just for repairs, it's also preventative.

Poly everywhere for a wheeler. For a cruiser, I'd say poly everywhere but the body and trans mount.

Moog and no, the TRE and DLE are different taper sizes. It has to be ordered correct.

[hatzie]

Ditch the rag joint and factory shaft. You can either use an XJ shaft or build your own with a new Borgeson telescoping shaft and Borgeson U-Joints. Borgeson also sells complete drop in U-Joint steering shafts for the 73-91 squares. Look a the prices and decide for yourself.

I'd replace the steering damper with a good quality unit.

Urethane spring bushings will not make the ride harsher than it already is. Use em. My 4WD trucks ride like a truck. Don't care. That's what they are.

I agree... Get MOOG swivel ball joints and tie rod ball joints. They're worth the price.
The GM 4WD Pitman or Steering Box arm is a socket not the ball joint. It connects to the back of the LH knuckle with a tie-rod assembly reminiscent of an automobile. Very easy to replace. No monkeying with the steering box to Pitman arm relationship is neccesary.
I did find it a little annoying that GM didn't thread a Tie-rod end onto or into the center link... instead they made the center link and LH tie rod end one long obnoxious expensive piece.

Check the upper & lower swivel ball joints

Make sure the frame behind the steering box is not cracked. You can add some very simple gussets to reduce the bending force applied to the frame horn by tying the steering box mounting bolts to the front frame crossmember. There are also weld-on stamped plates that will reinforce a weld repair of an already cracked frame horn.
Brace installation on undamaged frame. Four Wheel Drive Magazine.
Offroad Design makes the braces and the reinforcing plates. If you're handy you can fab your own braces but they're fairly inexpensive to buy when you factor in your time and you will not fab stamped reinforcing plates.
http://www.offroaddesign.com/catalog/steeringkit.htm

Don't adjust the steering box. If it's loose replace it.
AGCO Saginaw power steering article.
From the article --->"Many people have been mislead into thinking the adjusting nut on top of the steering gear is to remove slack. This adjustment is meant to set the initial lash, between the gears, when the box is built. This adjustment will NOT remove slack. Tightening this adjustment will force the gears together and cause them to bind. Ironically, binding gears make steering far more difficult and actually feel even more loose."

Download the Power Steering textbook from my manuals link and read through it. It's a GM Service Training group textbook that includes information on the Saginaw steering box and the power steering pump.
Flush out the power steering a couple times with cheap ATF and then re-fill with GM power steering fluid or just replace the power steering pump. I'd put a real Magnefine filter in the return line with Fuel Injection Clamps. If the return line is soft replace it with SAE J189 hose.

[1redbowtie3]

Good info, thanks for taking the time to post it ..

[enaberif]

Jeep shafts don't work on 76 and older trucks due to different power steering boxes

[slotard]

Originally Posted by enaberif

Jeep shafts don't work on 76 and older trucks due to different power steering boxes

Interesting, I didn't realize that. I swapped a steering column from a newer truck (don't remember year but I switched from push to pull ignition or the other way around, I forget), I thought I used the shaft from the newer column.

I take it I'd need a steering box from a newer truck to make that work?

[wilkin250r]

This truck is a Frankenstein of many different years and parts. However, the frame VIN indicates a 1979, and the majority of components seem to match. I'd give it a 90% likelihood the steering box is 1979.

[hatzie]

I'd stay clear of the Poly motor mounts too.

[wilkin250r]

As I mentioned in post #12, not only are my tires very large (40"), but they are also wide (wheels are 15" diameter, 14" wide). They also have a very small offset, which makes them stick out really far.

All this creates a huge amount of leverage acting against the steering components.

With all this force, I feel I could easily benefit from a dual-stabilizer setup. However, I think dual stabilizers are ugly. Does anybody know if I can purchase an aftermarket stabilizer (or have mine rebuilt) with significantly more damping force? Basically, can I make a single stabilizer setup as strong and effective as a dual-stabilizer?

[hatzie]

You can get motor home stabilizers with coilover springs.

With wide tires on that offset you should probably add the weld on plates. They'll be easier to put in before the frame horn cracks.

[slotard]

Is there any downside to the bolt-in brace on a truck that doesn't appear to have any problems?

[hatzie]

Originally Posted by slotard

Is there any downside to the bolt-in brace on a truck that doesn't appear to have any problems?

No.