51 over 78, what to look for

[DetroitDan]

If my crewcab sells I want to replace it with a much older pickup. Been ogling a 63 c10, love it but would want to upgrade the brake system and ignition. Then found this one, 51 parked on top of a 78 4wd k10. Love the idea of ps/pb dual master front disc, etc, and the parts availability of a 78 driveline. It looks cool as hell, I mean this truck is ME! However, it is likely somebody elses hackjob headache, and I don't know enough about them to know what to look for. I guess my biggest concerns would be 1: where and how the body is attached to the 78 frame; (when I did some reading here all I saw was axle swaps to the existing frames) and 2: what did they do with the steering column to make it work and be safe?
He says the bodywork is old and flawed, but it looks good in the pictures. Only looking for a cool truck to make dumpruns and home cheapo runs. Will never be a showtruck anyway, but if the bodywork wasn't too far gone I could straighten it up and paint it. Just as soon leave it and drive it like a ratrod, as long as there's no major pieces falling off.
here's a link: (PS- this is NOT my truck, I am linking it for discussion purposes)
http://nh.craigslist.org/cto/2364164760.html

[MrTucker]

The obvious answer is going to be that you just have to look at it. Check out the body mounts, bed mounts and core support. If the front fenders dont line up it could spell problems (meaning the frame and/or core support is f'ed up). After that, inspect the frame. Is it hacked up? Does it have any heavy welds that indicate it's been modified in any way? If they simply put the body on the frame, then there really isn't too much that they could have messed up. Inspect the steering closely, this could be an issue.

One thing that is comforting is that they claim is was built in the late 90's - if its been driven around that long it cant be too bad...

[DetroitDan]

emailed him and got some more pics, nose looks mint but cab has had some dent pulled or something right on the left cowl ahead of the door, doors scraped up, and rot holes at the bottoms of the fenders. Big project to make it nice, but perfect ratrod right now. But, I know me and I don't know if I could leave it alone and just play with it.

and I think it's a little steep money.

[MrTucker]

if it's solid mechanically, then I dont think it's bad for the price at all...

[55dude]

"RUN FOREST RUN!" the later running gear has track width too wide for that year truck and your gonna just inherit someone elses headaches. but dude it's your money.

[Rabunjeeper]

I had one just like that and it was scary as hell to drive. It was way too top heavy and it felt like you were going to roll when you went around a corner. It had 35s on it.

[mr48chev]

There is one running around the the Pacific North West setup pretty similar to that one.
I can't add much to what Mr Tucker already said in post 2.

Outside of checking the body for condition and checking the engine and running gear the main thing is to check their worksmanship in mounting the cab and bed on the chassis. I've seen some that were very well thought out and had well designed brackets holding the cab and bed on and I have seen some others that were real scary messes. You used to see a lot of similar trucks around here when some guy would either roll his later model truck in the hills and tear up the cab and bed or buy one that had been rolled and take the stock cab and bed off and swap on earlier sheetmetal.

The ding in front of the door is from the door being opened too far because the piece that keeps it from going too far has been left off. That is fairly normal on these cabs

[DetroitDan]

OK, now you guys have got me confused; one says track width is too wide, while the other says top heavy and tippy. Wouldn't wider track counteract the topheavy condition? And other than tire extension, what is wrong with having a wide track?

Appreciate the input! I certainly don't want to waste money on something that's going to be junk and scary to drive. I'm already leaning away from it and back toward the 65 c10.

[OrrieG]

On AD trucks the critical body alignment seems to be the hood to fenders and cowl. If that lines up and closes ok then someone paid attention to mounting it in the right place. I'd look at how the actual body and bed are mounted and the steering. If they used the 78 column you will probably find it is offset and not centered because of the wider frame. The look is usually a love/hate because the tires do stick out beyond the fenders.

I have a TF on 74 axles and have never felt it was tippy, the engine, transmission and transfercase sit low in relationship to the body so center of gravity is relatively low. I've had mine on some pretty steep side slopes and never felt it was going to roll. 78 parts are very plentiful, with a wide range that will fit.

[MrTucker]

Originally Posted by DetroitDan

OK, now you guys have got me confused; one says track width is too wide, while the other says top heavy and tippy...

If you're looking for a low riding truck and to have the wheels tuck inside the fenders, then yes, newer drive trains are going to be too wide. But this truck is supposed to be a big 4x4. As far as being top heavy and tippy - well, it is a lifted truck...

[DetroitDan]

Originally Posted by MrTucker

If you're looking for a low riding truck and to have the wheels tuck inside the fenders, then yes, newer drive trains are going to be too wide. But this truck is supposed to be a big 4x4. As far as being top heavy and tippy - well, it is a lifted truck...

I don't know if I'm allowed to say it on here, but I hate lowered trucks, especially when they're so low the whole wheel is tucked up inside and the body lays on the ground, making it look like the truck is utterly incapable of doing anything. I totally and absolutely fail to comprehend what people find attractive or cool about that look. I'm certain that is an unpopular view, particularly on this site. But, I can appreciate a nice truck that isn't lifted, and I can understand how people find really big lifted trucks obnoxious, so maybe we as a group can come together and enjoy the hobby of old trucks without hating each other.

(I wrote the last part in the hopes that it would prevent some people from flaming me for not liking lowered trucks;>)

[MrTucker]

I hear ya. I like lowered, lifted and stock trucks, so I like 'em all. It seems a lot of people tend to bash lifted trucks and say "they are top heavy and cant corner worth a damn." Duh - it's a truck! not a sports car!

to each his own...

[DetroitDan]

OK, now I think I get what you guys were saying. The track width is too wide, simply meaning the tires stick out, not that it would have anything at all to do with handling. I looked back at the pictures and it looks like the front tires stick out quite a bit, but the rears are tucked in. Typically GM 4wds have narrower rear axles than the front. I don't like the tires sticking way out. And I don't know about the legality of it here, for regular vehicles they have to be covered by fender flares, but I'm not sure if a vehicle registered as an antique would have to comply. Actually, I do know for certain if it is registered as a hotrod it doesn't have to have any fenders, so that would be the way to go.
The 65 I'm looking at is a lot nicer, but I'm not hugely thrilled at the prospect of driving a truck with points ignition, 4 wheel drum manual brakes and a single line brake system. At the very least, I'd convert it over to two line with a dual master, did that with both my 66 B-bodies. I want to be able to take my kids for rides, so in addition to upgrading brakes I'd be installing seatbelts. So I don't need 4wd, I just like the look and mostly like the idea of ps/pdb. But, the 65 is a lot cheaper and has pretty nice paint. The 65 would be passable for cruise night, the 51 not so much.

[DetroitDan]

I've owned at least 30 trucks, and most of them were lifted. I have no problem driving a lifted truck and never have come close to tipping one. Generally, for every inch the truck goes up, larger, wider tires go out a couple inches, so it keeps the handling within reason. And, New England roads aren't exactly conducive to lowered trucks. So Cal, this ain't!
Looks like the 51 has 31 inch tires on it, which are pretty small, about a stock size for a 4wd.

[Gene Sharp]

I say dont let it get away
Idrive one every day and love it
4x4 ZZ4 and 700r4
handles and drives as well as any blazer
and it is fun

Gene Sharp

[DetroitDan]

I actually gave up on it, took my 82 off the market and re-dedicated myself to building it instead.