Grandpa's old 1965 C10 Project

[Grandpas65]

Hello. I was fortunate enough to have my grandfather give me his old 1965 C10 SWB stepside last month. It was his daily driver until 3 years ago. Currently has a 305 V8 with the original 4 speed manual. The rest of the truck appears stock. It has a bent frame in the left rear tire area. I need to get the box off and get a better look at it, but I think I need to do a frame swap. Will 64-72' frames bolt up to cab and box mounts? Any input on the frame issue is appreciated. Here are a few pics the day I got it.

[1976gmc20]

I had one much like that except it was green and had the original 230 straight six (and of course the frame wasn't all mucked up like that). It would go almost anywhere that a 4wd would go. I traded some wood for it and used it for a chainsaw/tool hauling truck for years. Then I went back to school and like an idiot I sold it

I'm not sure what's wrong with yours ... looks like maybe somebody tried to lower [butcher!] it because that spring sure isn't right. Mine had the cantilever leaf overloads but I know the coils were much taller than that.

I'm sure you could make the cab fit a newer frame with enough work, but you could probably also fix your frame once the bed was off as long as you don't mind some welds and plates under there. Or if you could find another old non-restorable 60-66, you could just cut it in half and weld the whole back end of the frame onto yours. I'm not sure you have all the original pieces for the rear suspension ...?


I loved the cut out fender and driver side spare tire mount

[DPowers]

Congrats- I would be looking for another frame if it was me. Keep us updated on progress.

[dougf]

Dude, I would kill for something like that from my grandfather! Keep it forever and enjoy it!

[canadian_diesel1964]

Originally Posted by dougf

Dude, I would kill for something like that from my grandfather! Keep it forever and enjoy it!

Ditto! :

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

I had one much like that except it was green and had the original 230 straight six (and of course the frame wasn't all mucked up like that). It would go almost anywhere that a 4wd would go. I traded some wood for it and used it for a chainsaw/tool hauling truck for years. Then I went back to school and like an idiot I sold it

I'm not sure what's wrong with yours ... looks like maybe somebody tried to lower [butcher!] it because that spring sure isn't right. Mine had the cantilever leaf overloads but I know the coils were much taller than that.

I'm sure you could make the cab fit a newer frame with enough work, but you could probably also fix your frame once the bed was off as long as you don't mind some welds and plates under there. Or if you could find another old non-restorable 60-66, you could just cut it in half and weld the whole back end of the frame onto yours. I'm not sure you have all the original pieces for the rear suspension ...?


I loved the cut out fender and driver side spare tire mount

This truck was originally green, you can see green paint in places where it is chipping. I am now curious if this truck was lowered at some point. It does look lower than a stock truck. I also love the spare tire mount in the bed. Very old school flair.

Originally Posted by DPowers

Congrats- I would be looking for another frame if it was me. Keep us updated on progress.

I am searching Craigslist looking for a frame. I would like to convert the frame to disc brakes with possibly a 73' and up front crossmember setup before swapping my sheetmetal. I know you can buy spindles from CPP and others. Still reading up on the best course of action here.

Originally Posted by dougf

Dude, I would kill for something like that from my grandfather! Keep it forever and enjoy it!

I plan to keep it forever. I am thinking about getting a new frame first, then a LS swap to get it daily usable, and then using it like a truck. I am thinking about keeping the suspension stock height and using skinny 15" tires to keep that stock appearance.

[1976gmc20]

Well, I am a grandpa and I wish I hadn't sold my 1965 short stepside

It looks to me like the top spring mount is missing and that crappy angle iron welded in there. Also the spring has some coils cut off or it is not even the original spring. What does the other side look like ???

The spare tire mount is not only "old school" but it is also very practical. I also like those front stake pockets open all the way down to the side steps. I carried a long handled round point shovel upside down in the stake pocket on one side and a broom on the other. I had 1/2 an old seed drill box bolted in the bed for a chainsaw box (it's now in my 89 K1500!). I bolted a galvanized utility pole strap/brace bent in an L to the front of the box and the right fender, so a five gallon military metal gas would sit right down on the side step.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

Well, I am a grandpa and I wish I hadn't sold my 1965 short stepside

It looks to me like the top spring mount is missing and that crappy angle iron welded in there. Also the spring has some coils cut off or it is not even the original spring. What does the other side look like ???

The spare tire mount is not only "old school" but it is also very practical. I also like those front stake pockets open all the way down to the side steps. I carried a long handled round point shovel upside down in the stake pocket on one side and a broom on the other. I had 1/2 an old seed drill box bolted in the bed for a chainsaw box (it's now in my 89 K1500!). I bolted a galvanized utility pole strap/brace bent in an L to the front of the box and the right fender, so a five gallon military metal gas would sit right down on the side step.

Very neat info. Thanks for sharing. These trucks can be awesome as slammed/lowered hot rods but I prefer the stock look. It's a work truck like in your story. I intend to keep it that way but add an updated engine for reliability.

[1976gmc20]

I never found the Chevy straight six to be particularly unreliable. I did have a couple problems with it: the timing gear wore out and had to replace the head gasket. It supposedly had been rebuilt before I got it and now I have no idea the actual miles except well over 100K. I guess they didn't do such a great rebuild job if they didn't bother replacing the timing gear while it was apart.

Believe it or not, we all got around quite well back in the dark ages with points and carbs. You might have a little more routine maintenance but they will never strand you someplace. And that old SM420 is a great transmission

If you end up having to replace the frame, you might think about a short wheelbase 4x4 while you are going to the work of making the body mounts to fit. I know it can be done because there's lots of those "60-66" pickups on newer 4x4 chassis.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

I never found the Chevy straight six to be particularly unreliable. I did have a couple problems with it: the timing gear wore out and had to replace the head gasket. It supposedly had been rebuilt before I got it and now I have no idea the actual miles except well over 100K. I guess they didn't do such a great rebuild job if they didn't bother replacing the timing gear while it was apart.

Believe it or not, we all got around quite well back in the dark ages with points and carbs. You might have a little more routine maintenance but they will never strand you someplace. And that old SM420 is a great transmission

If you end up having to replace the frame, you might think about a short wheelbase 4x4 while you are going to the work of making the body mounts to fit. I know it can be done because there's lots of those "60-66" pickups on newer 4x4 chassis.

This truck has a 305 V8 from the 1980s in it. 2 barrel carb. I am thinking about a 4.8/5.3 and 4L60E swap. More civilized in city traffic and interstate situations.

[1976gmc20]

Well, that would certainly change the character of it. I guess I'm just not very civilized.

[TJ's Chevy]

Frame swap fer sure. Be easy and quick to. Also nice to have a parts truck handy.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by TJ's Chevy

Frame swap fer sure. Be easy and quick to. Also nice to have a parts truck handy.

Can I swap a later model frame say up to 1972 without much fabrication?

[TJ's Chevy]

I wouldn't see why not...CaptainFab would be the one to talk with on that subject. He knows all that stuff. I haven't had the need to do it so I haven't worried about the research. lol

[Captainfab]

I would definitely do a frame swap in this instance. I see lots of rust everywhere under there. A '63-'66 frame will be a direct swap. Even if all you can find is a long wheelbase frame. Shortening a frame will be much easier than fixing the one you have now. The welding on a frame needs to be done by a qualified welder.

A '67-'72 frame can work with a few modifications. The rear cab mount brackets will need changed, as well as the radiator support mount brackets will need to be moved. The front frame horns will need to be cut off and '63-'66 frame horns welded on so that you can bolt up a '63-'66 bumper. Also you will need to add the radiator crossmember.

Which ever way you go, be sure to check with your local DMV first to be sure you do the frame swap legally so as to satisfy their requirements.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

I would definitely do a frame swap in this instance. I see lots of rust everywhere under there. A '63-'66 frame will be a direct swap. Even if all you can find is a long wheelbase frame. Shortening a frame will be much easier than fixing the one you have now. The welding on a frame needs to be done by a qualified welder.

A '67-'72 frame can work with a few modifications. The rear cab mount brackets will need changed, as well as the radiator support mount brackets will need to be moved. The front frame horns will need to be cut off and '63-'66 frame horns welded on so that you can bolt up a '63-'66 bumper. Also you will need to add the radiator crossmember.

Which ever way you go, be sure to check with your local DMV first to be sure you do the frame swap legally so as to satisfy their requirements.

Thank you for your reply. Sounds like a 63-66' frame is the ticket. I was just looking at your various parts offerings. I really like the option to have rear discs and use the stock 15" wheels. I would like to keep the stock 15" wheels up front also. Is there a disc upgrade solution for the front that will allow for use of stock 15x6.5 wheels also?

[Captainfab]

The original wheels will not work with any disc brake conversion. The wheels simply are not designed to clear the calipers. You will have to locate some stock appearing 15" steel wheels.

Originally Posted by Grandpas65

Thank you for your reply. Sounds like a 63-66' frame is the ticket. I was just looking at your various parts offerings. I really like the option to have rear discs and use the stock 15" wheels. I would like to keep the stock 15" wheels up front also. Is there a disc upgrade solution for the front that will allow for use of stock 15x6.5 wheels also?

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

The original wheels will not work with any disc brake conversion. The wheels simply are not designed to clear the calipers. You will have to locate some stock appearing 15" steel wheels.

That's right The 1971++ 15" steel wheels look about the same but the back side is shaped different to clear the disc brake calipers. I found this out the hard way when I tried to borrow spare tires between pickups.


BTW, I think that I had a 305 2 barrel in a 1977 C-10 Suburban. All the time that I had it, I just assumed that it was another 350 but since then I've heard that Chevy never made a 350 2 barrel. Anyway, it had plenty of power and got up to 18 mpg with the SM465 four speed. We towed our camper trailer with it and also a heavily loaded U-Haul from CO to MT. Finally the suburban rusted out all around it. I wish that I had kept it for parts instead of trading it off.

[Chevy Fleetside]

I say frame swap also. Too bad your to far seeing I have a short bed frame doing nothing.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

That's right The 1971++ 15" steel wheels look about the same but the back side is shaped different to clear the disc brake calipers. I found this out the hard way when I tried to borrow spare tires between pickups.

So 1971+ C10 15" wheels would clear disk brakes? Up to what side rotors/calipers?

Originally Posted by Chevy Fleetside

I say frame swap also. Too bad your to far seeing I have a short bed frame doing nothing.

I wish I was closer but I should be able to find one within driving distance.

[Chevy Fleetside]

I just ordered a set of these. http://www.summitracing.com/search/d...rder=Ascending If you are going to use 71 wheels you will need 5 lug.

[Grandpas65]

Originally Posted by Chevy Fleetside

I just ordered a set of these. http://www.summitracing.com/search/d...rder=Ascending If you are going to use 71 wheels you will need 5 lug.

Thanks for the link and confirming 71+ is five lug. I found 6x5.5 bolt pattern smoothies at Coker Tires for $62. Do you think these will fit dog dish caps?

https://www.cokertire.com/smoothie-wheel-primed.html

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Grandpas65

Thanks for the link and confirming 71+ is five lug. I found 6x5.5 bolt pattern smoothies at Coker Tires for $62. Do you think these will fit dog dish caps?

https://www.cokertire.com/smoothie-wheel-primed.html

1971+ 4x4 15" wheels are six lug.

The bolt pattern for the newer ones exactly match your vintage.

I had a pair of 16" 6-lug with m/s tires for my 1965. Those would clear the bigger rear drums of the newer 4wds (up to about 1979 at least). I can't remember about the front but I thought I stuck one on the front of my 1971 K10.

[Chevy Fleetside]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

1971+ 4x4 15" wheels are six lug.

The bolt pattern for the newer ones exactly match your vintage.

I had a pair of 16" 6-lug with m/s tires for my 1965. Those would clear the bigger rear drums of the newer 4wds (up to about 1979 at least). I can't remember about the front but I thought I stuck one on the front of my 1971 K10.

And I have about 5 or 6 of the 6 lug rally wheels sitting doing nothing. Unless I use them on my other 65.

[1976gmc20]

Actually, the 6 lug bolt pattern stayed the same clear up through and including the GMT400 platform (88-98 pickups) but the back spacing is different so you can't use the 88-98 wheels on the older pickups. I suspect, though I haven't tried. you could use the 73-87 wheels on the 88-98 pickups but they would stick out quite a bit. All of which is quite useless information for the subject at hand

Anyway, I had a crazy idea: if you have to replace the frame anyway, I wonder if you could find the same vintage C-20 chassis and shorten it ??? That way you could have a 3/4 short bed with 16" eight lug wheels !!!