Nv4500 identification and conversion help needed

[dragn91]

Ive been lightly searching for an nv4500 to put behind the 6.2 in my k30 i know ill need the hydro pedals or an adapter bellhousing that will work with a manual clutch. My main problem is im come across a couple but dont know what one will fit my truck easiest. Will the cumming trans even work behind a 6.2? I heard there was adapters available for the lighter duty nv4500 s behind the 360 powered dodge trucks to fit the 6.2 are these a decent trans to run behind them?

[hatzie]

Originally Posted by dragn91

Ive been lightly searching for an nv4500 to put behind the 6.2 in my k30 i know ill need the hydro pedals or an adapter bellhousing that will work with a manual clutch.

My main problem is im come across a couple but dont know what one will fit my truck easiest.

Will the cumming trans even work behind a 6.2? I heard there was adapters available for the lighter duty nv4500 s behind the 360 powered dodge trucks to fit the 6.2 are these a decent trans to run behind them?

If they are trying to sell you a transmission with no bellhousing walk away.

Hydraulic clutch and Hydroboost brake pedals from a 1985-86 CK & 87-91 RV series.

The 6.xL AMG/Detroit engine have the Corporate "Chevy" bell to engine bolt pattern so it doesn't matter if the trans came from a 350, 454, or 6.xL.

ALL NV4500 have a completely different bell to transmission bolt pattern from any other GM transmission.
The 93-95 transmissions had a GM Specific NV4500 bell-to-transmission bolt pattern with fork and slave similar to the 85-91 squarebody trucks but the fork is on the lower RH side instead of the LH side.

The 96 and up have an internal slave/throwout bearing assembly. The GM NV4500 shared the Dodge bell-to-transmission pattern however Dodge transmissions will not fit GM applications. The Dodge input shaft dimensions, stickout and pilot bearing diameter, are different from GM and the 4x4 output spline count is different. If parts were easily available, and they are not, you could swap the input shaft and nose on a 2wd trans to change it from Dodge to GM.

I've done an NV4500 install in a 1976. If I had it to do again I'd do a Gear Vendors overdrive unit.
It's much easier to install.
It's much much less expensive when you factor in all of the little pieces you have to buy to install the NV4500 in a truck that never had one.
It has the same .73:1 overdrive ratio and you can engage the external OD in L-3 for three additional intermediate gears (eight forward gears) when towing really heavy stuff.
You can tow in OD with the Gear Vendors unit. The NV4500 will blow 5th off the end of the mainshaft if you tow in that gear.

[mongocanfly]

Hatzie covered it very well..I put a nv4500 in my 81 behind a 6.0 lq9..I used the later model gm nv..I couldn't find one anywhere that the seller could tell me much about it..they were outrageous in price for unknown mileage trans..I would up buying a rebuilt one that had a upgraded 5th gear for only a few hundred dollars more than a used one..I couldn't find enough factory parts to install it so I went with all advance adapters flywheel clutch bellhousing.. they take a special oil that's about $130 a gallon...I still had to buy a shifter as it didnt come with one..the dodge nv has a cable drive speedo the chevy has electronic speedo..so I had to use a dakota digital convertor to keep my stock speedometer...so its not a cheap venture....but I love it..

[hatzie]

The fluid is pricy stuff and a little obnoxious to obtain too.
Castrol Syntorque LT is no longer being made. Not to be confused with Syntech...
You can still get the Mopar 4874459 or GM 12346190 NV4500 fluid for around $20-$25 a quart. Rumor was it's simply re-labeled Castrol Syntorque LT so it may not be available long term. Amsoil sells an oil that claims proper compatibility with the above GM and Mopar oil numbers.http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produc...r-lube-75w-90/

If you can still get em... you used to be able to swap the stock carbon composite synchros out for bronze to be able to run a more available oil.

[dragn91]

I found a guy parting out a truck with a john deere diesel conversion with a nv4500 mounted behind it. Is there any way to tell if its a gm or dodge trans? He said he doesnt know and its still in the truck so i can count splines

[mongocanfly]

If its still in the truck look at the speedometer output..if its electric its a gm..if its cable drive its a dodge..other than that you'd have to look at input shaft..there may be other ways to tell but I'm not sure... on the fluid the only local place I could find any was at a dealership

[Chevy3+3]

What year is your K30? What tranny are you currently running?

Here is a link to my nv4500 swap in my '88 V30.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=701900

[Chevy3+3]

I would also like to add that Amsoil makes an oil formulated specifically for the NV4500 transmission. I have been running it with no problems yet. I can buy it for around $12/quart.

http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produc...?code=MTGQT-EA

[dragn91]

Thanks for all the great info guys. I found a guy with a 4x4 nv4500 in a chevy truck i think its the early model tho. Im gona try to do some bardering for it. But the swap will be a wile i still have to rebuild the rear brakes and i just got my new cab corners in so ill be doing floors rockers cab corners and front cab mounts first. Ill check back in when i get that all done and actually get the trans in my possesion.

[hatzie]

If it's a super low L from a 93 you just hit the lotto. I believe an Advance Adapters bell will let you use a mechanical clutch.

[Chevy3+3]

Originally Posted by hatzie

If it's a super low L from a 93 you just hit the lotto. I believe an Advance Adapters bell will let you use a mechanical clutch.

Mine was out of a '94. I thought 92-94 had the same ratios? My 1st gear is low enough, lol. I don't use it unless I'm pulling a heavy load

[hatzie]

NO. 93 had the ultra low 1st. 94 and later had the same L gear.

[dragn91]

Well i just back back from buying a 1994 4x4 nv4500 im gona try my best to figure out a way to mount this thing without using the advanced adapters bell but still keep mechanical clutch. I think i might just try to find a used steel blowproof bell and modify it to work with this trans. I also have to find a transfer case that will work with this trans my 205 behind the sm465 has the figure 8 pattern not the round. Anyone know what t case i should get? This will be mostly a daily driver/hauling truck no crazy offroading but id still like it to be pretty tuff. a round pattern 205 would be ideal but if i can get something else that will work cheaper im all ears.

[v30crewcab]

redrill your trans to use the normal bellhousing. you will need a 85-91 round pattern 205, 32 spline. you will need the AA 2" spacer to make it fit, or put a short 32 spline input and run without spacer, but you gotta notch the adapter pretty heavy. leave the carbon synchros and run the amsoil fluid. it works great.

[dragn91]

Hows the strength on the np 208 and 241s i hear i can bolt these directly on as well do i need to notch the tailhousing to use those? Im trying to stay close to the same length as the sm465 so i dont have to modify driveshafts. This wont be an off roading rig but it will tow alot and thru muddy feilds ect...

[hatzie]

The NP208 has a much lower low range 2:72:1 in the NP208 vs 1.96:1 of the NP205.

The biggest problem with the NP208C & NP241 is the body mounted shifter moving when the body mounts and or engine/transmission mounts are badly deteriorated or in hardcore offroad situations.

People point out that the NP208 is an aluminum case and chain drive... Just like ALL of the stock transfer cases installed in everything built since the mid 1990's. I don't see that as a minus. It's lighter putting less stress on the transmission and bellhousing.
If you are building a rock crawler, sand dune runner, or a ralleye truck that will be airborne while at full throttle or a mud/swamp truck you'll likely need the additional strength of the gear drive case. These are very specific hardcore offroad applications. For 4wd driving with excursions up nasty dirt roads at unpleasant times of the year you'll do just fine with transfer cases like the NP208 or NP241 or NP261 or ...


I keep both of my NP208C cases filled with the right oil. The original NP208 fill was Dexron III ATF. This is one of the cases where Dexron VI is not downward compatible... GM calls for GM 88861800 oil now. If you get a different case you'll need to check to see what it needs.

[v30crewcab]

dodge runs a 241 behind the cummins and it works just fine, I doubt you'll hurt it easily. it has an oil pump and is a little better than a 208, but either will work.

[dragn91]

What t case was used in squarebodys with factory 4l80s i found a guy parting out a diesel suburban i heard the t case from a th400 equipped truck will work whats about a 4l80. Thats for the help this 4x4 stuff is all new to me

[hatzie]

The 4L80E has a 32 spline output just like the NV4500 and the TH400.

[v30crewcab]

crewcabs with 4l80 had a 205, suburbans had the 241.

[hatzie]

Originally Posted by v30crewcab

crewcabs with 4l80 had a 205, suburbans had the 241.

I believe this was only true of the 1991 RV series.
The T400 CK 3500 series used Warner 14xx chain drive transfer cases and the T400 CK 2500 series used the LH drop NP241..

[dragn91]

Picked up what i believe is a np205 im pretty sure it is but there was no tag and im still pretty new to the 4x4 world but it has the right spline count and 6 round pattern. Got it for $80 and he threw in the crossmember from the truck. Said to be from a 88 k30 dump truck. Anyone know how i go about making this the same length as my current sm465/205 combo. Do i just notch the tailhousing and bolt the 205 strait to the tailhousing or would i have to get the spacer to make it the same length? I tried to measure but it was too dark out. Any other tips before i try to tackle this? Im really hoping i dont have to buy the $400 advanced adapters bellhousing the early nv4500 is suposed to have the same input bearing retainer size as the sm465 so it should center up in the bell im hoping theres enough meat to drill and tap at least the top two bolts in then i can weld a plate off the bottom to bolt the lower two on. Just a theory i dont have a spare bellhousing to try it out yet. Heres some pics of the t case and th400 crossmember whitch im hoping will work.

[Chevy3+3]

You stole that 205! And got a cross member to. I'm not sure on the length of the SM465 but I know that my Nv4500/205 combo was the exact same length as my factory th400/205 combo using the Advanced Adapters spacer. My crossmember bolted back up in the same spot and I didn't need to modify any drivelines.

To use the AA spacer you will need to unbolt the factory spacer over the input shaft of the 205.

[v30crewcab]

yep you gotta ditch the cast adapter, and either run the aa 2" spacer, or install a short input on the 205 and notch the crap outta the nv4500 adapter housing.
no idea how to match your other trans length. get a tape measure and check it out.

[v30crewcab]

Originally Posted by hatzie

I believe this was only true of the 1991 RV series.
The T400 CK 3500 series used Warner 14xx chain drive transfer cases and the T400 CK 2500 series used the LH drop NP241..

91 was the only year of the 4L80 so,,,
all the crewcabs used 205's though. never seen one that wasn't.