55.2-59 front sheet metal assembly

[FAKKY]

Does anyone have a good thread link to front metal assembly.

Confused on how it all goes back together since its been so long with it off. Especially the inner fender as well as stuff like what size bolts and any seals etc.

[FAKKY]

Main reason Im asking is due to interference with the inner fender where I need to weld a support bracket for the steering shaft.

Not much room.



You can see above - right where the ujoint is is where I will weld a support bracket to frame. But it interferes with that lower lip of fender - so probably have to cut it out.


side view - should the sheet metal sit off the frame here ?




What goes in the large hole down by frame at firewall ?


Front - this seem right - sheet metal of inner doesnt quite touch the frame.

[Johns327]

This is a great recourse.

https://www.trifive.com/55-59Assy.pdf

My steering went all over the place. Ended up with two supports.

John

[Black_Sheep]

You don't necessarily want the inner fender touching the frame. They have already been cut for the subframe swap so trimming a little more from problem areas is no big deal.

The factory assembly manual is invaluable if you are putting one of these trucks together, especially if you didn't take it apart or it's been altered by a previous owner. I bought a manual but it's been digitized and posted online, maybe someone can post a link.

[mr48chev]

Well Bud I think you are on the right path. I'd have done the same in that I'd have installed the core support and then gently trimmed the inner fenders to clear but not leave gaping openings around what I need to clear. That is from experience that isn't good as my truck has the ugliest holes you can imagine where it use to clear the A frames when I had it subframed.

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by Johns327

This is a great recourse.

https://www.trifive.com/55-59Assy.pdf

My steering went all over the place. Ended up with two supports.

John

Thanks thats awesome. How does you steering work now - good ? I got mine finally done without a double joint ..... but all angles are around 30-36 degrees so near max.

Originally Posted by Black_Sheep

You don't necessarily want the inner fender touching the frame. They have already been cut for the subframe swap so trimming a little more from problem areas is no big deal.

The factory assembly manual is invaluable if you are putting one of these trucks together, especially if you didn't take it apart or it's been altered by a previous owner. I bought a manual but it's been digitized and posted online, maybe someone can post a link.

Thanks BSheep.

Originally Posted by mr48chev

Well Bud I think you are on the right path. I'd have done the same in that I'd have installed the core support and then gently trimmed the inner fenders to clear but not leave gaping openings around what I need to clear. That is from experience that isn't good as my truck has the ugliest holes you can imagine where it use to clear the A frames when I had it subframed.

Thanks ... I was sort of expecting that there was a rear bolt to support it near the firewall ..... but I actually found some old pics on my phone when I tore it down and it "looks" like it "hangs" from the outer/main front fender .... sort of like a skirt .....

[dsraven]

there should be an L bracket on the firewall, bolted on down low, then the inner fender had a rubberized grommet with a steel tube insert that held the lower rear portion of the inner fender from flapping around. there was also a rubber seal stapled onto the inner fender rear edge where it could seal against the firewall and stop some slop from spraying in off the wheels.
trim as required to leave a small gap around everything so nothing rubs when the body flexes. hang some rubber off the edges to keep the slop out. done deal.

[Johns327]

Fakky,
Yes it runs straight at 70 on the freeway, I’m happy with it but it looks crazy. One single joint at the column, one double with two supports, one single at the rack and pinion.
Where I cut my inner fenders, I added a piece of 3/4” by 1/8” steel to the outside (in the wheel well) to add back in some strength removed since I cut out that metal crease GM put in. Didn’t want any flexing in there. Not sure it’s needed but I tend to over build stuff.
Glad that manual helped, I found it a bit of a PIA to use, but there is a ton of stuff in it.
John

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by dsraven

there should be an L bracket on the firewall, bolted on down low, then the inner fender had a rubberized grommet with a steel tube insert that held the lower rear portion of the inner fender from flapping around. there was also a rubber seal stapled onto the inner fender rear edge where it could seal against the firewall and stop some slop from spraying in off the wheels.
trim as required to leave a small gap around everything so nothing rubs when the body flexes. hang some rubber off the edges to keep the slop out. done deal.

DSRAVEN - do you have a pic/link with pic of the L shaped bracket - Im not sure exactly what I need here - pretty sure I dont have one anymore. So trying to think what I can fabricate to work. Do you have a recommendation on where to get seal for fender - or just any regular rubber seal that fits.

-- update - I think i found the L bracket you mean on the FAM John posted above. Under "Skirt to Cab instructyion". So literally a L bracket thats bolted to firewall - and then skirt just bolts to that.

Originally Posted by Johns327

Fakky,
Yes it runs straight at 70 on the freeway, I’m happy with it but it looks crazy. One single joint at the column, one double with two supports, one single at the rack and pinion.
Where I cut my inner fenders, I added a piece of 3/4” by 1/8” steel to the outside (in the wheel well) to add back in some strength removed since I cut out that metal crease GM put in. Didn’t want any flexing in there. Not sure it’s needed but I tend to over build stuff.
Glad that manual helped, I found it a bit of a PIA to use, but there is a ton of stuff in it.
John

Thanks - interesting on the double joints - I fought that for many days - and gave up going back with the singles at max angles. The problem I had was the column would shift 1/4" front to back and create enough slow in the double joint it could bind. But wonder if I will have to go back to a double ujoint later given the max angles its running at now ... 30-36 degrees depending on joint ....

Manual is awesome ... but yeah a bit confusing also

[dsraven]

start looking around page 448 of 736. it shows an L bracket bolted to the firewall with (2) studs on the firewall and then a through bolt with rubber grommet at the connection from inner fender to that bracket. I could easily see those elbow smasher studs being ground off during a rebuild or customization. anyway, here is a link to the assembly manual. if you don't have the studs you could easily get some dimensions from somebody on here with a stock firewall or simply look on the inside floor area for a reinforced spot where the studs went through to a plate or something. i can't exactly remember how that part looked but know you should be able to find the spot from the inside if "repaired" on the engine side of the firewall.

https://www.trifive.com/55-59Assy.pdf

[dsraven]

post 2 above, 3rd pic down. shows the studs on the firewall where the inner fender gets bolted up. inner fender has a big hole there where the grommet installs. you would need to install the "L" bracket on the firewall with 2 nuts/washers and then on the inner fender the rubber grommet with the steel tube insert, then a bolt goes through the steel insert in the grommet and tightens up against the insert so the bolt gets tight but the grommet stays movable. should be a matching one on the other side. I think there is a large washer on each side as well. check the assembly manual.

[dsraven]

thre should also be a seal on the edge of the inner fender so the steel parts don't rub against each other under body flex. then trim the inner fender lower section to miss the frame. if you cut too much off just install a light duty rubber flap around the edge like a newer vehicles uses. it allows some movement of the parts without rubbing but also keeps the dirt/splashes out of the engine bay.

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by dsraven

post 2 above, 3rd pic down. shows the studs on the firewall where the inner fender gets bolted up. inner fender has a big hole there where the grommet installs. you would need to install the "L" bracket on the firewall with 2 nuts/washers and then on the inner fender the rubber grommet with the steel tube insert, then a bolt goes through the steel insert in the grommet and tightens up against the insert so the bolt gets tight but the grommet stays movable. should be a matching one on the other side. I think there is a large washer on each side as well. check the assembly manual.

Thanks man.
After you mentioned it I went back outside and looked and saw the two studs .... on both sides ...... so will have to fabricate something to use there. Should be fine.

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by dsraven

thre should also be a seal on the edge of the inner fender so the steel parts don't rub against each other under body flex. then trim the inner fender lower section to miss the frame. if you cut too much off just install a light duty rubber flap around the edge like a newer vehicles uses. it allows some movement of the parts without rubbing but also keeps the dirt/splashes out of the engine bay.

Thanks ... any edge/seal work ? Home depot etc ?

I've already scratched the heck out of the paint in firewall by putting it up and down around 10 times. :P

[dsraven]

check this page in lmc catalogue for a description and part number you can google or amazon or ebay ,whatever. you will need (2) of the braces, (1) of the grommet sets and (1) of the seal sets.


1
38-7380 BRACE-INNER FNDR TO CAB $12.95 $12.95

http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/ca/full.aspx?Page=17


1
30-1279 FENDER GROMMET SET(4 PC S $5.95 $5.95

http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/ca/full.aspx?Page=31

1
30-2321 FRONT FENDER GASKET SET $12.95 $12.95

http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/ca/full.aspx?Page=31

hope that helps.

[FAKKY]

Your awesome as always man. Always forget about LMC when I cant find on ebay.
You and a couple of the guys here really need to make a book

[dsraven]

sorry, no time for a book. getting a tattoo of a handsome guy put on my face right now. besides, everybody would need a hieroglyphics dictionary to decipher my writing, lol.
just trying to help out where I can.

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by dsraven

sorry, no time for a book. getting a tattoo of a handsome guy put on my face right now. besides, everybody would need a hieroglyphics dictionary to decipher my writing, lol.
just trying to help out where I can.

[DransportGarage]

I wanted to tell you how to install the 38-7380 braces you're about to buy from LMC (i.e., NOT as mirror images, but both facing the same way), so while I was at it, I thought I'd give you my full front end install procedure. This is WAAAAY more than you need, but maybe you'll get an idea or two. I wrote this during my MANY pre-installs so I wouldn't tear the paint up too much on final assembly. Some parts on my truck are not stock (like the billet grille), my fender-to-inner fender gaskets have shrunk from age, etc., but you'll get the idea. All trucks are different, but this is what I do on my crooked-(tailed) truck:

CORE SUPPORT:
1) Apply tape to the passenger upper rear core support tab where it will contact the inner fender.
2) Loosely assemble bolts, nuts, washers, spacers (1 thick, 1 thin on passenger side, 1 thick on driver side) and cushions according to the assembly manual.
3) Pull core support toward the driver's side, into the "custom" notches, as a starting point, and tighten the Driver side 7/16"-14 x 2" support-to-frame bolt ONLY to 20 ft.lbs. (Other side to be tightened after inner fenders are in place.

NOTE: If the passenger core support 7/16:-14 x 2" bolt is tightened
here, the core support will be too far forward for the inner fender to be installed.

INNER FENDERS (Part 1):
1) Install the lower firewall brackets such that nuts are on the driver's side of both brackets.
2) Install two (2) large grommets into large holes in each inner fender (thin side to the inside), weather strip onto rear edges, and edge guards at a-arm.
3) Apply protective masking tape to the top of the firewall flange. (Inner fender will rest here.) Lay towels over the frame and a-arms.
4) Loosely install the two (2) bolts that go through the large rubber grommets).
5) Pull passenger side of core support as far forward as possible and tighten bolt to 20 ft.lbs.

HOOD:
1) Install hinges to firewall as low as possible, cheating them toward the driver's side.
2) Install hood to hinges while cheating the hood to the driver's side.

FENDER - DRIVER:
1) Apply protective tape to rear edge of fender and front edge of door, and ESPECIALLY to the front 6" of the corner of the step.
2) Position one (1) 0.094" washer (marked "#/8") for the upper 3/8"-16 x ¾" fender-to-cowl bolt.
3) While holding the fender in place, loosely install the 5/16"-18 x ¾" fender-to-inner fender bolt that is second from the front.
4) Loosely install the 3/8"-16 x ¾" upper fender-to-cowl bolt.
5) Install the lower 3/8" x ¾" bolt (near step). Snug the bolt lightly for alignment. USE NO SHIMS.
6) Align the fender to door and cowl, then tighten the 3/8"-16 x ¾" upper fender-to-cowl bolt to 20 ft. lbs.
7) Align lower fender to door seam and torque the lower fender bolt to 20 ft. lbs.
8) Remove the 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolt that was installed in step 3).
9) Use a wooden shim to spread the gasket gap between the fender and inner fender at the rear.
10) Because the gasket is too short, use a piece of ¾" folded masking tape as a "tongue" on the front of the gasket so the gasket can be stretched while in place.
11) While slightly pressing down and pulling outward on the front of the fender, slip the fender-to-inner fender gasket into place from the side, starting at the rear. Hold open with wood shims if necessary.
12) Loosely install the 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolts, starting at the rear. Using the tape "tongue", stretch the gasket as needed until all 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolts except the front one are loosely installed.
13) Remove shim between fender and step.

Fender Extension:
1) Put a double layer of tape on:
a) the bottom tang where the fender extension will touch the fender.
b) the inner lower edge where the fender extension will touch the inner fender.

2) Loosely install top 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolt.
3) Starting at the top, install the four (4) #10-32 screws, washers and nuts.
4) While pulling the inner fender toward the outside, tighten the top 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolt. (This will eliminate the gap between fender and inner fender and allow the second bolt to be installed).
5) Install the 2nd, 3rd and 4th 5/16"-18 x ½" bolts. (Leave 2nd, 3rd and 4th loose on this side.)

FENDER - PASSENGER:
1) Apply protective tape to rear edge of fender and front edge of door, and ESPECIALLY to the front 6" of the corner of the step.
2) Position one (1) 1/8" shim for the upper 3/8"-16 x ¾" fender-to-cowl bolt.
3) While holding the fender in place, loosely install the 5/16"-18 x ¾" fender-to-inner fender bolt that is second from the front.
4) Loosely install the 3/8"-16 x ¾" upper fender-to-cowl bolt.
5) Install the lower 3/8" x ¾" bolt (near step). Insert a 1/8" shim, fully engaging it by pushing it up. Snug the bolt for alignment.
6) Align the fender to door and cowl, then tighten the 3/8"-16 x ¾" upper fender-to-cowl bolt to 20 ft. lbs.
7) Align lower fender to door seam and torque the lower fender bolt to 20 ft. lbs.
8) Remove the 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolt that was installed in step 3).
9) Use a wooden shim to spread the gasket gap between the fender and inner fender at the rear.
10) Because the gasket is too short, use a piece of ¾" folded masking tape as a "tongue" on the front of the gasket so the gasket can be stretched while in place.
11) While slightly pressing down and pulling outward on the front of the fender, slip the fender-to-inner fender gasket into place from the side, starting at the rear. Hold open with wood shims if necessary.
12) Loosely install the 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolts, starting at the rear. Using the tape "tongue", stretch the gasket as needed until all 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolts except the front one are loosely installed.

Fender Extension:
1) Put a double layer of tape on:
a) the bottom tang where it will touch the fender.
b) the inner lower edge where it will touch the inner fender.

2) Install the top 5/16"-18 x ¾ bolt.
3) Starting at the top, install the four (4) #10-32 screws, washers and nuts.
4) Install the 2nd bolt.
5) While pulling the inner fender toward the outside, tighten the top 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolt.
6) Tighten the 2nd inner fender bolt
7) Install and tighten the 2nd 5/16"-18 x ½" bolt, then install the 3rd and 4th bolts.


LOWER GRILLE BAR:

NOTE: Bolts are numbered below starting with forward-most bolt.

1) Protect both frame horns and driver side sheet metal with towels.
2) In order, install passenger side 5/16"-18 x ¾" bolts 2,1,4 and 3.
3) On driver side, install bolts 2, 1 and 3. Snug bolt 2, then install bolt 4. Loosen bolt 2.
4) Loosen bolt 2, snug bolt 3, then install bolt 4.
5) Tighten driver side bolts 1, 2, 3, 4.
6) On passenger side, snug bolt 3. Then, in order, tighten bolts 1, 2, 3, 4.

UPPER GRILLE BAR:
1) Install the driver forward bolt first (since it's the only one with a nut), then the other three.
2) Install 3/8" x 1" core support top bolts.
3) Tighten upper grille bar bolts starting with driver side.
4) Tighten upper core support bolts.


NOTE: The driver's fender (and possibly the passenger's) can be loosened at the top for final alignment at this point. For spacing, use two taped 1/8" shims, one squeezed against the step and one squeezed by closing the door, 3" from the top.

INNER FENDERS (Part 2):
1) Tighten top rear 5/16" x ½" bolt while pulling inner fender outward to eliminate the gap at the fender.
2) Do the same for the top front 5/16" x ½" bolt.
3) Do the same to the other two top 5/16" x ½" bolts.
4) Torque the lower rear, then lower front 5/16" x 1" inner fender bolts to 75 in-lb.



FINAL BOLT TIGHTENING:
1) Starting at the inner fenders and, working toward the bumper, tighten all front end fasteners.

NOTE: Install the following in order:
1. A/C condenser.
2. Grille.
3. Hood latch into hood latch panel.
4. Hood latch panel.

GRILLE:
1) Protect lower grille bar with towel.
2) Hang grill from top outside holes using two #8-32 x ¾" screws and nylocks. Remove towel.
3) Mount as low as possible, with bottom as forward as it will go, using washers where necessary so that all screws can be torqued.

[_Ogre]

Originally Posted by dsraven

38-7380 BRACE-INNER FNDR TO CAB $12.95 $12.95

http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/ca/full.aspx?Page=17

fyi... both brackets go the same way, they are not mirror mounted

[DransportGarage]

Originally Posted by _Ogre

fyi... both brackets go the same way, they are not mirror mounted

Great minds think alike...

[FAKKY]

Originally Posted by DransportGarage

Great minds think alike...

Thanks Ogre.
DransportGarage - thats an awesome update. Appreciate you taking the time to post that here. It should probably be copied by someone out of this thread and stuck in a sticky somewhere.

Do you guys think its worth buying the bracket - seems like in the pics its just a L bracket that gets bolted to allow a horizontal bolt to go through inner fender/grommet and tie to bracket - meaning - just weld/fab one ?

[DransportGarage]

Originally Posted by FAKKY

<snip>
Do you guys think its worth buying the bracket - seems like in the pics its just a L bracket that gets bolted to allow a horizontal bolt to go through inner fender/grommet and tie to bracket - meaning - just weld/fab one ?

The bracket is as simple as it looks, but be sure position the inner fender mounting hole the right distance from the firewall. It's a little hard to measure with the truck together and on the ground, but it looks like that dimension is 1-5/16", and centered on the two stud holes. Maybe someone here can verify. There is some play in the factory mounting grommet that will help you if you're off a little.

[FAKKY]

Thanks DransportGarage

[dsraven]

here are a few angles with dimensions for those lower inner fender brackets on the firewall. hope that helps.