47-55.1 Options for moving the radiator forward

[IvelDesigns]

I can't go look at my front clip right now, but what options do i have for moving my radiator forward? I already plan to get a new radiator, so aftermarket options are OK. I was planning on going with a drop in 4 core, but if i have to do something else i will.

My issue is that after mocking up my motor mounts for the BBC i'm putting in my '50, i'm finding that from the end of my water pump to the firewall is at 30.5". by the time i get a spacer and a fan on there, we're looking at around 32"-33". From what someone else has told me, stock distance, firewall to radiator is 29".

I'm really trying to avoid cutting the firewall and pushing it back about 4", so i'm curious if anyone else has ideas for making some more room.

[Fred T]

I don't have pics, but my friend cut the top off the radiator support and used a radiator from a big truck, 1.5 or 2 ton. He moved the radiator forward a couple of inches.

To do what you're wanting you need to go the electric fan route.

[britnjc]

I just moved my radiator forward this past weekend. I essentiall just mounted it to the front of the rad. support. I made a spacer which in turn bolted to the radiator and then bolted to tthe front of the old support. I dont have pics with me but I can get some.

[britnjc]

Oh yeah my radiator was a 1969 ford mustang radiator all alum and welded. It is very well put together radiator and I got it off ebay new for around 200 dollars check this link and it will take you to his store. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...3AIT&viewitem=

[britnjc]

try this link the other didnt work. This will take you direct to his ebay store. http://myworld.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ledfoot_racing/

[Houston54]

I do not think you will be able to fit that BB in without changing the firewall. All the big block installations I have seen required it. Not saying it cannot be done as anything is possible but that is the "typical" method on these trucks.

If it were me I would get a *****in products firewall and be done with it. Since it appears you are a pretty good fabricator you can probably bend one up yourself and splice it into the existing.

I think it would simplify your installation. There are other issues besides the radiator that complicate your current approach to the problem.

[IvelDesigns]

Originally Posted by Fred T

I don't have pics, but my friend cut the top off the radiator support and used a radiator from a big truck, 1.5 or 2 ton. He moved the radiator forward a couple of inches.

To do what you're wanting you need to go the electric fan route.

Yeah, I think going with an electric pusher fan is going to help a lot. I was looking on summit last night and they don't seem to expensive.

Originally Posted by britnjc

I just moved my radiator forward this past weekend. I essentiall just mounted it to the front of the rad. support. I made a spacer which in turn bolted to the radiator and then bolted to tthe front of the old support. I dont have pics with me but I can get some.

Can you get me some pics of your install and/or some dimensions of the radiator you used? Did you have any issues running the hoses? and does that radiator have the tranny cooler built in?

Originally Posted by Houston54

I do not think you will be able to fit that BB in without changing the firewall. All the big block installations I have seen required it. Not saying it cannot be done as anything is possible but that is the "typical" method on these trucks.

If it were me I would get a *****in products firewall and be done with it. Since it appears you are a pretty good fabricator you can probably bend one up yourself and splice it into the existing.

I think it would simplify your installation. There are other issues besides the radiator that complicate your current approach to the problem.

Yeah, if i go the route of moving the firewall, i plan to cut from the firewall/cowl seam, down and then push the whole thing back. My concern with doing that is the steering column is going to have even less room than i do now. As it sits now, the steering column has about 5 inches outside of the firewall before it needs to have a U-joint to clear the headers.

What other issues do you see that would complicate this?

[britnjc]

The radiator does have to cooler built in it and the demensions and other info are as follows:Core Dimensions: 16 1/2" high x 20 1/4" wide (3 row core)

· Overall Dimensions: 21" high x 22" (including brackets)
· Upper inlet: 1 1/2" located on passenger side.

· Lower outlet: 1 1/2" located on driver side.

· Automatic transmission oil cooler: Included

· Bracket mounting system

· Billet style fill neck construction NOT STAMPED

· OEM style brass T-style petcock drain. Not plastic like others sold on eBay

· Radiator cap is included. Other aluminum radiators do not include the cap

It is a very quality piece. It is 3 row but states will cool 700 HP. As far as my hoses I will not have a problem getting them on. I although cant afford a the motor I want right now so I am sticking with the 4.3 ltr that was in the S10 that I frame swapped.

[Houston54]

I looked hard at using a mustang radiator in my 54 but I never got a good feeling that it would do the trick in Houston temps with AC so I spent the extra cash on a direct replacement 4 row unit from US Radiator. It is the typical "Desert Cooler" model with a trans cooler.

One of the lessons I learned during my build was that there are some areas where you just have to spend the money or it can come back on you later. At that point you have to respend money to get things right.

Seeing as how the radiator is such a vital element of the system I would not cheap out there. Especially running a big block. Spend the cash on a new radiator that you know will handle the cooling.

As to other problems you may have with your installation I think you hit a good one with the steering column. I am not sure which unit you are using so it is hard to offer a suggestion. I have seen where some have cut down a GM truck column to make it fit. Other spend the cash on an aftermarket unit. The extra width of the engine will certainly cause some header clearance issues. I will do some searching to see what others may have done but this may be another area where you will have to throw cash at it to get a good solution.

My key advice is to look down the road to the point when you get the truck on the road. Do you want to have your fingers crossed that something will work as you hope or do you want to have that peace of mind that it is as good as it can be.

[Houston54]

Let me add also that if you are thinking of moving the firewall back you only need to do in the area directly behind the engine. I took it from your comment you were thinking of moving the entire firewall, cowl to cowl, back which is not what you want to do. Just enough to clear your valve covers. This should remove the concern you mentioned regarding the steering column length.

[IvelDesigns]

yeah, that's what i meant. I was sayin i'd do it from the seam on the firewall below the cowl, on down. with the BBC and tall valve covers, it's pretty close to the column hole. If i try to avoid the column hole, it's going to look a little funky since i'd basically be making a direct outline of the engine/valve covers

I'm still kickin' ideas around. I may be able to get by w/o hacking it up.

[mr48chev]

Some of those steel garden wheelbarrow pans make nice firewall indentatons to clear an engine.

I've been there, done that and have the greasy Tshirt when it comes to cutting radiator supports and moving radiators and all I can say is don't do it. The usual results are way too many squeeks and cracked and leaking radiators. Plus after a few thousand miles all that work you went to to fit the nose right is gone and wasted.

[Houston54]

Here is an example of a big block installation with the firewall mod. You can see the inside of the cab is not impacted that much in terms of foot room/pedal placement.

http://www.hotrodsforsale.com/site/g...path=12&page=1

[OrrieG]

I'm sure you have thought about it but what about using an electric water pump with push fan on the radiator. I know from what I have seen on the build threads here notching the firewall is what it required. In my mind three cuts and welds are a lot easier than refabricating the whole radiator, hood latch, fender mounting assembly. Getting cab/hood/fenders/inner fenders are hard enough as it is.

[britnjc]

If all you are need are a couple of inches then the route I went was easiest for me. My truck is not a show truck by any means but I am not going to cut corners for reliability. I basically just mounted my radiator on the front of the core support. By doin this I am not adding any more stress to the radiator, it still mount on the same metal core support that mounts in the stock location. You do not have to change any mounting points for core support, fenders, hood latches, etc. It will be as good as originall just 2 inches forward. When I mocked up the grille I had probably 3 to 4 inches in front of the coresupport to play with. My radiator is in the shop having the bottom outlet relocated close to the passenger side because it was in front of drive pulley. I will get it back tomorrow and mount it back on the front and take a couple of pictures to show.

[britnjc]

by the way it only took me about two hours to get it mounted where I needed. Alot easier than moving my motor back.

[discodadee]

I'm with Orrie on this one, electric fan and water pump combo, superior performance and more room!

[IvelDesigns]

I went out and looked at my front clip tonight and it looks like i can easily move the radiator forward 2" without impacting the hood or the latch. I will need to make different grill supports, but that's no big deal.

So as of right now the plan is to move the rad forward 2", run an electric pusher fan, and cut the fire wall to get the engine back 2". that should give me plenty of clearance for what i need.

Should i still consider running a fan shroud on the engine side of the radiator even though the fan will be on the other side? I'll have the room for one, and my thought is that it would help to direct the air flow over the engine.

[50adrod]

Originally Posted by IvelDesigns

I went out and looked at my front clip tonight and it looks like i can easily move the radiator forward 2" without impacting the hood or the latch. I will need to make different grill supports, but that's no big deal.

So as of right now the plan is to move the rad forward 2", run an electric pusher fan, and cut the fire wall to get the engine back 2". that should give me plenty of clearance for what i need.

Should i still consider running a fan shroud on the engine side of the radiator even though the fan will be on the other side? I'll have the room for one, and my thought is that it would help to direct the air flow over the engine.

A shroud will not be needed on the engine side, the purpose of the shroud is to direct airflow across the radiator. not to cool the engine itself, besides it might look a little funny

[youngrodder]

Originally Posted by britnjc

by the way it only took me about two hours to get it mounted where I needed. Alot easier than moving my motor back.

Do you have any pictures that you could share of your radiator moved 2" out??

Thanks
Marc

[britnjc]

I took my radiator to the shop thursday to have the bottom outlet relocated and was expecting to get it back yesterday. I am going to get it monday and will take pictures them. I am excited to get it back in the truck so I can hook up all water and tranny fluid and crank my bucket up and movet it on its own power for the first time.

[IvelDesigns]

Originally Posted by britnjc

try this link the other didnt work. This will take you direct to his ebay store. http://myworld.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ledfoot_racing/

Looks like I will be getting the 49-54 chevy truck radiator from this guy if he can get one with a trans cooler built in. If he can't, i'll probably still get it and just get an external trans cooler.

prices and feedback seem really good. $220 for a radiator is about a 1/3 the price of all the other places i've looked.

[pgf545]

Take a look at my thread, we are doing a big block in a 52. I think it will fit without messing with the firewall but ours was so torn up i had to replace it. I went with a *****in Products one and a radiator from PRC Hot Rods. Very nice piece but pricy. If there is anything else that might help you let me know.

Bernie

[britnjc]

like I said before I got my all alluminum 3 row with tranny cooler for 200 even on ebay. fully welded seams and necks very good quality. A lot more cooling fins per sq. inch than most radiators. It is worth looking into. check out the link above I posted to this guys ebay store. I got my radiator in and very impressed. I just had to have my bottom neck relocated because of engine interference so 200 for rad. and ~40 for modification. most of you will probably not have to make the same mod anyways. My radiator is a 1969 mustang radiator that fits the core supports width. Look into this guy, he may even have some 4 row for you big block guys for insurance.

[youngrodder]

I would like to buy one of the same radiators but I need one with the bottom hose location on the rt (pass) side. I have an LT1 for my engine and those have reverse cooling.

What specific modification did you have made to yours and who did the work?

Thanks
Marc