John Lee's Weber DGEV 32/36 Two BBL Carb for I6 (Install thread/not tuning)

[Sharps40]

And, prize of prizes.....Carburation thats less than 48 years old....with some linkage bits too.



GoodWife Sharps is at work all night....I'm playin in the garage with no worries and a big cigar. I even got a fuel filter here for it. So, per Mr. Langdon, ignor the Weber Carb fuel pressure and delivery myths. 4 to 8 lbs from a mechanical pump is perfect. Never use a fuel pressure regulator and do use a good fuel filter, do it right once I think he's sayin. (Pretty much matches up with what I read on Inliners and on the Ford Sixes sites. So, I'm rollin with what the Engineer of the Engine says is right.)

Mount the bowl faceing forward, primary venturi will be next to the engine valve cover, secondary will be on the Port (left - outside of the engine faceing the inner fender), never mount it backwards but sideways is okay if I'm not into cornering races.

[Sharps40]

Last time we are likely to see this air cleaner and whats under it.



The old leaky Rochester Model B...been on there a long time.



Like Mr. Langdon said, gotta match the transdapt adapter slots to the Weber holes.



A file in a drill is a poor mans mill...just a kiss to make a whisker of room for each of the bolts that fasten carb to adapter.



Now the adapter is fitting the carb right.



Chevy linkage attached to the carb, make yer own linkage ready to modify beside it...raising the carb on an adapter so need a longer link.



It don't have to get cherry red, plenty hot will get it maliable enough to bend w/o breaking...a quench will reharden good steel.



Bring whatcha got in my shop, a rod bender made of pipe, vice grips and a rifle reloading press....

[Sharps40]

Chevy linkage, short, off the carb, new made long link installed....



Just roughing in, not bad, a bit close though.



A quick trim of 1/2" of chevy throttle shaft makes clearance.



I moved the pin inboard for better alignment...might move it up a bit later, the function is a bit stiff and I can't feather the throttle. But plenty of adjustment in the chevy shaft and the new shaft and all them holes to stick stuff into....time to play with it and fine tune it this week and weekend.

[Sharps40]

The transdapt gasket between the carb and adapter has slots...with the weber base, huge vacuum leaks are pending...time to cut one from my Felpro stock.



After cutting the outside shape, press hard so the carb holes marke the gasket, outline em and cut em out a bit small to fit snug on the bolts. I use curved toenail scissors, they do the job pretty slick on tight curves. A drill press would do it too.



Adapter mounted to carb and tracing out the hole for both barrels.



Now thats a gasket I can live with, no vacuum leaks.



A couple traced out, I'll cut em later and put them in the road kit under the seat.



Its easier to bring the carb and base together off the manifold...new gasket is sammiched in there too.



From the top, linkage reattached, carb bolted to manifold...I'll tune the linkage later.



View from the drivers side.

[Sharps40]

A shot of the roughed in linkage with the PCV hose out of the way. Almost all factory C10.



Hooked up the gas and ported vacuum for the dizzy. I'll have to get a filter, can't find the one I bought...but its a new tank and clean, so for a test run it'll be fine. I also installed the air cleaner adapter on top of the carb.



All together and one last check before the test fire - yep, ran outta time and didn't hook up the electric choke, but I'll start it anyway.



Electric choke is the black wheel between the valve cover and the carb.



Okay, I test ran the truck, needs tuneing and has a flat spot on transition from one to two barrels. I'll go back and do some reading....but fine tuneing first, could be too lean or could be not enough advance, etc. Fun stuff. I installed a test lead to the electric choke, it opened the butterflys and smoothed up the idle. So for now, I tuned the idle mixture and it seems fine around 550 rpm. But, all week to tweek and test drive. I'm lookin forward to gettin this one set and forgettin it for about 80K miles of reliable drivin.

Here it is after the run, idlen with the test lead on the choke.

[Sharps40]

Okay, slow methodical work this evening. Some fine teaking of the linkage for better leverage, last nights set up worked but was sticky off the line, impossible to feather into the clutch and quite jerkey because of some bind. Good news is I retained 95% of 1965 C10 linkage with only 1/2" of the chevy connecting rod removed...to recovert to Rochester Mod B is dooable and the removal of the rod end will go functionally and cosmetically invisible.

So, compare last nights linkage photos and you'll see that I moved the Langdon vertical connector from manifold side to valve cover side of the bellcrank. Had to find a reversed dogleg shaft clip out of the junk box to make it work. I also moved the ball joint from the lower inner hole of the carb lever to the outer center hole...plenty of range of movement, nothing binds and the geometry is better....I looked at the model B and it also had the ball joint on a centerline with the butterfly shaft, neither above or below. So, in copying factory geometry closely, I wound up with smooth even motion and no binding. In addition, look at tonights photo of the long horizintal chevy connecting rod, I moved the threaded connector about 1/2 to 3/4 further back on the shaft...went too far the first time (all the way to the firewall end and bottomed the threads) and the pedal was vertical and off the spoon in the cab. I went out again with the threaded fitting about 1/4 inch from being bottomed out and perfect pedal function, though a bit more vertical than before, no worries though, I can mash it flat whenever I want! Hooked it all back up including the stout chevy return spring and it functions as smooth and easy as it did with the Rochester B on the manifold.



See, now the bell crank and the vertical connector make a Vee and I'm not having to move the connector over center while pushing it up. Very smooth and easy. The parts are better situated to move in smooth arcs now.



Installed a fuel filter and spankey new rubber fuel line and spanky new clamps. I stayed with the factory routing but I think I'm going to add a heat shied wrap to the fuel line where it passes between the head and the thermostat houseing...just in case, a vapor lock preventor.



Every tool in my shop is multi purpose from stanley chisel screwdrivers to pillips screwdriver punches to RCBS Reloading press soldering iron fixture. Here setting up one end of a 14g wire that will power the automatic choke from the fuze panel. I selected one of two Ignition Unfuzed slots as they are on with key off with key. Checked the power both ways and ran the wire in the harness to the fuze panel.



To keep the bay neat and factory looking, kinda stupid with a big 2 bbl wearin a spun aluminium hat huh? Anyway, I ran the auto choke wire along the valve cover following the dizzy vacuum and fuel lines and taped it in with the wires comeing from the sending unit in the head. This carries the wire back around the PS of the engine and right back over to a factory hole in the firewall just above the rear light harness. From ther, up over and around the inside of the dash to plug in directly to the fuze panel open ports. Very neat and the wire is bundled, can't be seen or called out...looks 1965ish kinda.



Turned on the power and watched the chokes slowely open...killed the power and watched em cool down and close.



From there it was a lotta time on my knees on the DS inner fender listening to the engine run as I fiddled with screws wedged under the linkage and between the carb and valve cover...Valve cover gets hot! I set the mixture back to zero and came out 2 full turns. Set the idle speed to zero and came into contact + 1.5 turns. It started fine, would not idle, Idle speed was 350 rpm with these required initial settings (to keep from uncovering the transition ports and never gettin it set right.) So, fuddled with the gas pedal, damn it works smooth! and got John Lee Jr warmed up...he stalled again. So, gave the mixture 1/2 more turn out and he started up and idled at 375 rpm, rough like a tractor but instructions say, it will run rough like a tractor, ignor it, don't fitzel the speed screw and start first by tweekin the lean idle setting.....screw it in to 2 turns, it dropped to 250 RPM but kept running and it was rough....went out to 2.5 turns and 425 rpm and much smoother, 3.5 turns out and rolling and no faster so back to 2 and 2.25 and 2.5 and 3 and settled on 2.5 as the best combination of smoothness and fastest RPM...

Off to the speed screw, it was 1.5 turns in from contact and so I added 1/4 turn in and the hot idle was now 500 + a scooch RPM, just what Motors says it should idle at. Popped on the air cleaner and started working the trottle thru its paces, easy, snappy, DAMNSKIPPIE THE SECONDARY IS OPEN AND THE EXHAUST IS A SCREAMIN DEAMON BURSTIN THRU THE CLOUDS! So, I did that again a few more times....Mr. Thush sounds pretty spankey growley when the motors really spinnin.

No test ride. I want it to cool all night and tomorrow I want to do a cold start to make sure the choke kicks up a fast idle and then will kick down to regular idle when I tap the pedal. If that works, ya can bet I'm headin out and if it feels good, Rt 1 is 70 MPH now tween Sanford and Raleigh...

[Sharps40]

A big step forward. Tonight it started fine. Rough idle comeing off choke. Incidentally Fast idle is bout right. I can already tell though - bit of a cold natured carb sittin up on a 3" high adapter.

But the test ride was a bit of a dissappointment. A real lack of power across the entire RPM range and flat/surging on the secondary. What to do? Momma at work, power is out and we're between tornados North and Hell Storms South. I think I'll check plugs and timeing.

Plugs looked fine. White insulator, light black soot on rim and just gettin yellow/brown at the gap. Hmmm-the instructions I didn't follow from Mr Langdon suggested up to 18 degrees BTDC with the GM HEI. Figured Nah - too much, factory is only 4 with points afterall. I had the HEI set at 10 BTDC and it ran great on the Model B. I thought 10 was my big adventure in timeing.

But what the heck- assuming I have the carb close (I followed instructions the 2nd time I adjusted it) let's hook up and be real adventurous with 12 BTDC. Well, rpm went up and the motor smoothed out more. WTF? Bumped it to 15 BTDC and smoother yet. Test ride time. Buttoned John Lee Jr up and right up the driveway I could feel it. He was gettin out of his own way. Out on RT42 the acceleration and power were up and smooth. No surge, no ping. (Iffin ya'll woulda told me up to 18 BTDC I'da figgered ya fer fools).

I-m rollin smooth at 60 mph and decided - I gotta know. Mashed that pedal flat. NO FLAT SPOT! Just smooth even power pouring on slow and steady. ****Fire we're onta sumthin here! Yanked my foot off the gas and the engine pulled down smooth from 70+ mph. Man-O, did it again, over and over - same results, and No Pinging. Ah heck now I really gotta fine tune this carb and ignition.

It's gonna be just fine I think. Highway run tomorrow fer sure!

[Sharps40]

Okay, no hash marks on the choke dial, so when I get the idle speed/mixture/timeing vetted out, I'll hash it with a sharpie and try clocking it in.

For now....a view from the drivers seat....small dash mounted tach shows the same speeds on the dial as my Tach/Dwell/RPM meter so they are either both right or both exactly the same out of calibration. I vote to believe option one.



The ugly wingnut gets replaced tonight too....starten to get a Mr. Gasket addiction...oh no! Mister gasket pic later on. For now, admire the uglyness of the about to go in the parts box wingnut.



On advice of Counsel, and good advice too, the plastic fantastic fuel filter is gone...to be replaced by a nice shiney metal filter for a big V8 Dodge. Dodge V8 filter on a Chevy I6, thats funny there, I don't care if you have a mental disorder and like MOPAR. Oh yeah, almost forgot, nice nut!



As recommended, old cartridge cases and a small smasher wacker do in fact make great gasket punches. In this case, a beater fired 3006 cuts perfect holes for carb mounting bolts on my homemade spare gaskets.

[Sharps40]

Much tuning went into the Weber 32/36. Easily done....richening the idle mixture and transition, leaning the main, richening the secondary transition and richening the secondary main.

To say I'm happy is an understatement. The tuning was simple 5 minute tweaks made at each refill of the tank to monitor performance over a full tank of gas each time. Each change usually made noticeable improvements. The most recent pulls on the interstate, we simply let off the gas pedal at 90+ mph as the engine (3 speed trans with 3.73 rear) had yet to run out of breath or power and we had certainty overdriven the suspension and brakes in any event.

As of the time of this post, I have....

1. Perfect reliability

2. Perfect/quick hot and cold starts with out ever having to pump the gas pedal in advance, just tweak it slightly as soon as it catches.

3. Increadibly smooth idle.

4. More power and speed than I ever thought possible from a low compression 1971 Olds 250 inline six.

5. Average combined city and highway mileage of 18.5 mpg on 87 octane pump gas.

For now we are putting together a Chevy Astro Van T5 transmission which could add as much as 3 to 5 mpg and put John Lee in the modern 70 to 75 mph highway cruiser bracket and still be able to hold a conversation at that speed!

Mark the Weber 32/36 as (my opinion) the most responsive and reliable carb I have ever delt with. I would never go back to anything else.

[TJ's Chevy]

Cool!!! Here's a picture of what I did to mine! Mine is over carbed but cruises awesome!

[Sharps40]

Is that a big Holley on a Clifford?

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Is that a big Holley on a Clifford?

600 CFM Edelbrock, mounted on a Clifford ram flow intake with Clifford headers. If you ever can I would get the Clifford intake with the 2 barrel adapter(They have one for a weber) and the Short Tube Headers. You won't notice a really big difference till you put headers on also. When I did the 4 barrel swap and header on mine it accelerated alot better even after the 3,000 RPM rang(When they have lost most of their torque)! And it pulls out in second gear a heck of a lot easier with a full load! Horse power and torque rating for my 292 as of now are 185 hp and 280 foot pounds of torque. Factory was 153 hp and 260 foot pounds. The little weber you have on there is a great carb! The intake is $320(Better choice then the offey) and the headers are $340. Langon's cast iron non-tube headers are $277 and give the same performance......T.J.

[Sharps40]

Dadgum thats big. I used to run a 500 carter on a 300 horse 327 in my Impala.

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Dadgum thats big. I used to run a 500 carter on a 300 horse 327 in my Impala.

Runs good though and doesn't have to much of a problem burning the fuel. When I get the better hei on it, it will run alot better.

[NixxiN]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

A big step forward. Tonight it started fine. Rough idle comeing off choke. Incidentally Fast idle is bout right. I can already tell though - bit of a cold natured carb sittin up on a 3" high adapter.

But the test ride was a bit of a dissappointment. A real lack of power across the entire RPM range and flat/surging on the secondary. What to do? Momma at work, power is out and we're between tornados North and Hell Storms South. I think I'll check plugs and timeing.

Plugs looked fine. White insulator, light black soot on rim and just gettin yellow/brown at the gap. Hmmm-the instructions I didn't follow from Mr Langdon suggested up to 18 degrees BTDC with the GM HEI. Figured Nah - too much, factory is only 4 with points afterall. I had the HEI set at 10 BTDC and it ran great on the Model B. I thought 10 was my big adventure in timeing.

But what the heck- assuming I have the carb close (I followed instructions the 2nd time I adjusted it) let's hook up and be real adventurous with 12 BTDC. Well, rpm went up and the motor smoothed out more. WTF? Bumped it to 15 BTDC and smoother yet. Test ride time. Buttoned John Lee Jr up and right up the driveway I could feel it. He was gettin out of his own way. Out on RT42 the acceleration and power were up and smooth. No surge, no ping. (Iffin ya'll woulda told me up to 18 BTDC I'da figgered ya fer fools).

I-m rollin smooth at 60 mph and decided - I gotta know. Mashed that pedal flat. NO FLAT SPOT! Just smooth even power pouring on slow and steady. ****Fire we're onta sumthin here! Yanked my foot off the gas and the engine pulled down smooth from 70+ mph. Man-O, did it again, over and over - same results, and No Pinging. Ah heck now I really gotta fine tune this carb and ignition.

It's gonna be just fine I think. Highway run tomorrow fer sure!

Can I ask how you timed it to 15btdc? My timing plate only goes to 10 btdc from what I can tell

[Sharps40]

I posted a thread called....John Lee's HEI Swap for an I6 (Measuring 30+ degrees on the Factory Tab!)


http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=599566

Pretty simply, I put the factory notch at 12 advance....filed in a new notch at 0. So, when the second notch is at 12 your actually measuring 24.

If you put the second notch at 12 (which is actually 24) and make a third mark at 0....the third mark will measure 36 when opposite the 12 on the tab.....

Confused....pics in the attached tread. Once done you can dial in accurately in 1 degree increments and never have a timeing tape that is fallin off or placed wrong, etc. Plus the marks you make are free! If ya use a silver sharpie, the marks are not even permanent/or source of confusion later.

[Sharps40]

I ran it up to 18 degrees and as I leaned leaned the main and richened the secondary I had to tweek timeing to eliminate light ping at the top of the main and into a too lean secondary.

The carb is now jetted away from initial settings about 15% richer on idle and transition, 11% leaner on the main, about 17% richer on the secondary transition and about 15% richer on the secondary main ....

This combined with 16 degrees of initial timing on the GM HEI set up by Mr. Langdon (soft spring in the can he calls it) and hot plugs yields what feels to me like gobbs of power on my stock 250 from idle all the way to WOT and 90+ mph. And 18.5ish mph on 87 octane for the combined average mileage.