l92/6l80 will not start/can't read codes

[67Steven]

I have a 2008 Hummer drive train with 13K on the clock going into a 1972 Blazer.

This is my first time with an LS motor, and I am having problems.

I did not get the ECM from the original truck, but I did send the TCM to a tuner who matched an ECM from an 08 Denali I believe and tuned it around that VIN.

I purchased a wiring harness from PSI and installed it. My problems started there. I had given Jon a list of components I had (basically stock) , and he was supposed to build the harness around there. The MAP, MAF and O2 plugs were all wrong, and I had to change the plugs to match my sensors except the O2, I purchased new units to match the harness as Jon said it wouldn't matter to the ECU. They gave me tap shift wire, but didn't want it, only 1 fan wire when I needed 2, and no provision to tell the ECU the truck is in 4lo.

I finally tried to start it last weekend, and it will crank, but not start. I tried to use my scanner, (Innova 3130c) but it will not connect. I have checked and rechecked all my grounds, verified 12v at "On" and "Crank", and that the trans plug is all the way in and not turning with the lock ring.

The noid light flashes when I crank, but only once bright, then dim, then nothing. Jon has said that the 'starter checks' are still on- would this cause all my issues? Would this not allow the ECU to communicate with the scanner? The tuner has verified that the VATS was removed, is this the same as starter checks?

Another note- I depressed the accelerator pedal and it does not move the throttle- is this due to starter checks?

I pulled the Injectors out last night to clean them if they were plugged, and I am putting new o-rings on today.

List of components:

ECU 12617630 (serv# 12612384) E38 Has 08 GMC Denali program

O2 12581966 (programmed for 12589321 if it matters)

MAF 25168491 (I changed plug to match this)

MAP 09359409 (I changed plug to match this)

Pedal 25832864

Injectors 12580681

Any help is appreciated, I (and my kids) would love to hear this thing start.

Thanks,
Steven

[faribran]

dont know what is going on with yourz... but when i first tried to start my 5.3, my injectors were clogged.... i cleaned those and now it runs like a champ... i hope you get it going. sounds like a sweet setup

[BR3W CITY]

vats is anti-theft. I'm not sure what he means by "starter checks"

"startup checks" would be the TB and Pedal checking each other to make sure that the tps input is correct. When you go key-on, the tb should open and close in a 2 step *click, click*.

If your tb and pedal aren't communicating, then there is either a mismatch in the components, a problem with the tune, or a loose/damaged/incorrect wire.

[dayj1]

The e38 is a Gen IV ECM. The Gen IV ECMs test for faults in the starter control circuit and cut power to the injectors if the checks don't pass. If the check is still in your tune (and it sound's like you verified that it is), you'll need to check the schematics for your application and run the starter relay control wire from the pcm to ground through a relay coil or 80 ohm resistor to get the starter check to pass.

The above should not affect the scanner connection or the DBW components, though. It sounds like you may have additional problems.

[BR3W CITY]

^^Under 20 posts and providing useful information! Thats like the unicorn of the internet.

[faribran]

BR3W, yes, that is why i hang around here........

[67Steven]

Spoke with Wayne (my tuner) and he looked up my tune and verified that starter checks and VATS are off. He said wiring is wrong if the pedal does not move at key on. The scanner is getting power, as it turns on when inserted- Wayne thinks maybe data pins 6 and 14 are reversed.

I am going to put everything back together this weekend and see what else I can find. I will look up pin outs for the throttle and check those also.

Thanks for the help so far!

[jorgensensc]

DID YOU STEAL MY POST!! Ha, sorry, couldn't resist. Your problems were almost verbatim my exact problems. Including vendors. I have an '08 escalade 6.2 with '11 6l80e. My harness is also from PSI. I also had multiple problems with my harness and connectors. First question, is your MAF plug on the drivers side or passenger side? I ordered a l92 harness and was sent an ls3 harness. My invoice said l92 also. What should have tipped me off was that The MAF sensor lead was on the driver side ( where the MAF is on camaros) not on the passenger side (like trucks). The other tip was the lack of VVT wiring. There was only a cam sensor. The wires were in the loom, but he had to send me the correct 5 wire pigtail. My MAP sensor plug was wrong also, as well as wired incorrectly for l92. The MAF wire was wrong also for an l92. Here is part of your problem. The pedal wiring is probably backwards (like mine was) and not set up for the truck pedal. You will have to rewire that also.
Now, I also was not getting any signal to the dlc. The can bus signal goes from the ECM, to the trans, then to a BCM (if you have one, I don't) then to the dlc. If there is no communication through the trans, you will not get a signal through the trans, you will not get a signal to the dlc. I jumpered from the canbus wires at the computer straight to the dlc and got signal, so I knew there was an issue at the trans. DOUBLE CHECK YOUR PLUGGED IN AT THE TRANS!!! I messed with mine at least 20 times, but never realized it wasn't plugged in all the way. Make sure the lock ring is pulled all the way up on the plug. Mine wasn't but it still acted normal. Then verify you have power to the trans. Without power you will not pass the signal on to the dlc.
Next verify you absolutely have the correct ECM serv number for your year trans you are running. Verify you in fact have an '08 trans. With serial number. I thought mine was an '08, turned out to be a 2011. The Tcm acts differently between different years internally switching, etc, so it matters. Verify. If you don't have the correct year trans and Tcm the wires to the plug are a little different. For instance, in '08 the TCC is ran from the brake light switch to the trans. This will disengage the clutch. In '11 the wire just goes to the computer, not to the trans. The computer then tells the trans to disengage the TCC.
Make sure they used a correct year ECM, and didn't just try to overwrite another year ECM. You can't overwrite the operating systems on these accords certain years. It will not work. It will brick the eCM, or give you problems.
I also didn't have both wires for the fans, even though I requested it. And I think the. Tap shift wire is standard, mine had it.
One last thing that may or may not pertain. When the canbus goes from the trans to the bcm there is a 120ohm terminating resistor there. Then it goes to the dlc. I had read that if there is no bcm you need to put a resistor at the dlc. I did. Then while troubleshooting issues I removed it. I haven't seen an issue either way, but I may put it back in anyway, it won't hurt.
Hope this helps a little. Feel free to ask me anymore questions, hopefully I can help. I feel your pain!!
Shawn

[Kainedogg]

Susbscribed for the end result.

[Hart_Rod]

+1

[67Steven]

Wow. I just read your thread Shawn, what a pain to go through that. Had I know there were so many issues with PSI, I would have thought twice before my purchase. Like you, I thought it would crank and fire first time, lol.

Yes, my invoice says L92, but it is LS3. I had asked for a long tail on the MAF for the passenger side, but it came short, LS3, and set up for the drivers side. The MAP is also LS3. When I called to complain about the incorrect wiring, he told me he though I was using an LS3 intake. I was not happy. When I first purchased it, I talked to Jon for quite a while, telling him EVERYTHING I was doing with the truck, and what I needed from him. I even sent a list of components to check they would work. Apparently, he does not write stuff down.

Nothing has gone smoothly with this harness- I ended up tearing all the tape and wire wrap off to get it to conform to the engine and get the MAF to the right side. Jon seems to help when problems arise, but usually it's to tell me to check connections and that there is a problem with the tune.

Which brings me to today. I called and spoke with the tuner and verified I had the proper tune for the 08 H2. The trans and engine are from the same rig (I took the harness and transfer case off myself) and checked serial numbers. I did check and check and check ad-nausea the trans connector, 12v and grounds- even have a new platinum Diehard.

So, I sat around thinking of something I overlooked. The only thing I hadn't done was swap out the two relays on the PSI harness. I did so, and BAM! scanner immediately connected to the ECM. Don't know how I missed that earlier. I could hear the click, so I assumed they were operational. The scanner brought up the following codes:

P1682
U0101
P2119 pedal I think?

I haven't researched these yet, but I will tonight and then try to fire it if I can get the pedal to work. I am going to find the pin outs for my pedal and verify they are correct.

I will update this when I get a resolution. Thanks for all the help.

[chuckmc8]

subbed in, please keep thread updated with results

[jorgensensc]

Glad I was able to help, in some way. I too told spent much time telling him everything that I was doing and using. Same thing, just didn't seem to be retained for some reason. There was an orange wire in the harness that was not used for something (I have look at my notes, I think neutral safety switch) that I moved over to fan 2 on the ECM and happened to be in a good spot for the 2nd fan relay. That way I didn't have to run a new wire through the whole harness. Be prepared though, he will send you a bag of pins and some wires with vague instructions to fix the wiring problems.
Glad you found the relay issue. That does seem odd, however I found that the instructions showed the relays wired differently than they actually were wired. They work either way, but just goes to show the lack of detail.
I'm curios though, he said he thought you were using an ls3 intake? Did you use the stock truck injectors? Because if you were using an ls3 intake your injectors wouldn't plug in correctly would they? I thought they were different connectors , l92 injectors vs ls3 injectors. It is all very interesting! Good luck firing it up.
Shawn

[67Steven]

Originally Posted by jorgensensc

There was an orange wire in the harness that was not used for something (I have look at my notes, I think neutral safety switch)

Do we not need to run a neutral/park safety switch? I am not using a column shift, so maybe I do?

Originally Posted by jorgensensc

Be prepared though, he will send you a bag of pins and some wires with vague instructions to fix the wiring problems.

Honestly, if I can find the pin-outs I will souce my stuff elsewhere, without his help

Originally Posted by jorgensensc

I'm curios though, he said he thought you were using an ls3 intake? Did you use the stock truck injectors? Because if you were using an ls3 intake your injectors wouldn't plug in correctly would they? I thought they were different connectors , l92 injectors vs ls3 injectors. It is all very interesting!

Exactly. He just sent what they had and is letting me deal with the issues. I told him all stock engine from a Hummer, never mentioned LS3 ever. At least my tuner is on board with the problems and is helpful.

What really gets me is the fact that I wanted a switch to tell the ECM I was in 4lo for the shift points and the speedo to work correctly as I have read that is an issue. He spoke like he knew all about it and he charged me $20 extra and 2 weeks longer to wire it. I get the harness and no wire. When I pressed the issue through multiple emails and calls with no returns, he finally admitted they didn't wire for it, and sent me a wire diagram and the offer to refund $20. What an insane way to run a business.

Originally Posted by jorgensensc

Good luck firing it up.
Shawn

Thanks

[67Steven]

Originally Posted by chuckmc8

subbed in, please keep thread updated with results

No problem, I will.

[jorgensensc]

In the PSI harness there is an orange wire that tells the computer when your in neutral/park. Supposedly it's not needed on 6l80e transmissions. I still wired the starter through the column neutral safety switch just like before, so I don't have an issue there. But the orange wire goes to the ECM. I just pulled out of its location, and moved it to the 2nd fan signal location. The other end of the wire is in the bundle you have to wire up, but I just ran it to the fan relay. That way I didn't have to run a new wire the whole length of the loom.

Oh, and as far as Jon helping with problems. He offered to refund my money when I was first trying to explain what was going on. He said I don't have time to deal with this just send it back. Well, I had already installed it. So I said, no you need to make this right. Then I asked him if he made the harness or did he have other people make it for him. He responded that he has a crew that makes them I said" then you need to be quiet and listen to what I have to say. Evidently they are messing up your orders, and since your name is on the product then your name is the one getting trashed." He seemed to listen then. That's when he said it sounded like I got sent the wrong harness. He then offered to get me a new ECM (since I had the wrong ECM year for my combo) to make up for the problem. It took two weeks before he finally got back with me and then said his supplier sent the wrong one. Then it took another 2 weeks to get the right one to him, then another week before I got it. And guess what. IT STILL DOESNT WORK!!!! It appears its a bad ECM. My tuner thinks someone tried to write the wrong OS to it, and then tried to rewrite it. Effectively screwing it all up. So he "helped" me out by taking a month to get me a bad ECM. And when I called and left a message a week ago just saying I needed to talk to him and had a question about the ECM he sent me, not a return call one have I gotten!
On the upside I thought the harness looked nice when I got it. Little did I know it was going to turn into all this drama. I should have just modified the stock harness!
I don't know if you went to alldatadiy.com yet, but it will be your best friend for diagrams.

[lynnfield]

Wow, I almost ordered my harness from PSI. I found both good and bad reviews about him and ultimately decided to order from someone else.

[AMERICAN PICK-UP]

that is why when i sell a complete liftout you get the engine,trans,wiring and ecm from the same vehicle. we can even send the factory engine wiring harness and get it modified for a five wire install.

[BR3W CITY]

I had my harness setup from FuelInjectionConnection; Nicely laid out, loomed, and had every connector correct. I had to make a last minute change to the alternator wiring, and was sent the connector, a pigtail and nice hand written instructions apologizing for the issue (it wasn't even their fault). They were the same ballpark as everyone else in cost ($450-650 depending). My sh!t was wired in an afternoon, started first crank.

just sayin.

[jorgensensc]

Thanks for the salt Br3w! J/k.

[chuckmc8]

On my first LS swap, I bought a harness that was modified and ready to go and had no problems. The VATS were not turned off on the PCM and that was a hassle, but when that was resolved, Truck started first touch of the key and never looked back. Drive by wire application.


The next one, I wanted to learn about the systems of the LS engines. so I researched and did the harness myself. I sent the PCM to be tuned ($75 inc return postage) Every plug fit perfect (it came off that eng and trans!) First touch of the key and it ran perfect as well. This was drive by wire as well.

I enjoyed doing the harness modification even tho I had advised others from trying it previously. In reality, its prolly the only way to really understand what the components of the LS series motors do and how they are connected. The absolute GOLDEN RULE is as American Pickup posted: Get everything- I mean EVERYTHING from the same donor vehicle. If at all possible, hear it run before it is pulled. If you install it and cant get it to run and you just heard it run great in the donor a couple weeks before, you get a huge head start on troubleshooting the problem. Dont be afraid to pass on a bargain price if its not all from the same donor- it will bite you on the behind!

[67Steven]

Well, after a crap load of emails between Jon and I the last two days and little to no help from him other than he "needs to see the tune"...

I got sick and tired of trying to figure out what was wrong. So, tonight when I got home I unplugged the entire PSI harness and plugged in the OEM harness.

*A little background here: I bought the engine, trans and transfer which included the original uncut harness. Since it was from a Hummer, the wire harness to the ECM was extremely short, basically right in the space where my hydro-boost and brake lines were occupying. Wayne (tuner) modified my harness to be a stand-alone unit before I realized it was so short. So I made the fatefully wrong decision to grab the PSI harness since it put the ECM in the cabin.*

Anyhow, I plugged it in, connected the battery and turned the key on. Throttle pedal worked! I was a kid in a candy store! Turned the key to start and it started and idled! But died. It will start and idle for 4-6 seconds- I do not have the MAF, MAP or O2 sensors in place, as this was a quick install (and I stole those plugs for the PSI harness) just to see if it worked, so I assume when I get a good, complete harness it should work.

I am planning on an email to PSI tonight and explain what I did and see what he says. I have wasted 3 weekends and many week nights trying to track down problems on my end and it was his harness all along. I also spent a lot of time re-routing his harness to fit my install. I am trying to decide if I should have him send a new harness or just a refund and source a new one.

Oh, no throttle or transmission codes on the OEM harness!

I'll check back after my contact with PSI.

[67Steven]

Originally Posted by lynnfield

Wow, I almost ordered my harness from PSI. I found both good and bad reviews about him and ultimately decided to order from someone else.

Uhhh... who?

If you don't mind.

[67Steven]

Originally Posted by jorgensensc

Oh, and as far as Jon helping with problems. He offered to refund my money when I was first trying to explain what was going on. He said I don't have time to deal with this just send it back. Well, I had already installed it. So I said, no you need to make this right. Then I asked him if he made the harness or did he have other people make it for him. He responded that he has a crew that makes them I said" then you need to be quiet and listen to what I have to say. Evidently they are messing up your orders, and since your name is on the product then your name is the one getting trashed." He seemed to listen then. That's when he said it sounded like I got sent the wrong harness. He then offered to get me a new ECM (since I had the wrong ECM year for my combo) to make up for the problem. It took two weeks before he finally got back with me and then said his supplier sent the wrong one. Then it took another 2 weeks to get the right one to him, then another week before I got it. And guess what. IT STILL DOESNT WORK!!!! It appears its a bad ECM. My tuner thinks someone tried to write the wrong OS to it, and then tried to rewrite it. Effectively screwing it all up. So he "helped" me out by taking a month to get me a bad ECM. And when I called and left a message a week ago just saying I needed to talk to him and had a question about the ECM he sent me, not a return call one have I gotten!
On the upside I thought the harness looked nice when I got it. Little did I know it was going to turn into all this drama. I should have just modified the stock harness!
I don't know if you went to alldatadiy.com yet, but it will be your best friend for diagrams.

Well, I will see what he says tomorrow.

I would say I can't believe he sent you a used, much less a bad ECM but at this point I don't think he even cares. He has your money, he's just trying to make you go away.

I will check out alldatadiy this week, thanks for the heads-up.

[lynnfield]

After doing some research, and finding both good and bad things posted about PSI I was leaning towards going with Speartech. Someone here on the board pointed me towards BP Automotive. I talked to Bill several times, he uses all the same production tooling as the factory to build his harnesses (same with Speartech, Howell and some others). The price was good, he returned all my calls, answered my questions, and I wasn't able to find any negative reports about his company.