Loose Lug Nuts

[engineer_gregh]

Once I installed the McGard lug nuts I didn't have any more problems. I've since changed the wheels.

[firedemon]

chrome and especially aluminum rims tend to let the lugs loose for some reason I use a torq stick and check them often

[CST10]

Hard to tell by the photos, but I think those are shank style lug nuts with flats washer style holes.

I'd call the wheel manufacture and make sure you have the correct style lug nuts.

[garyd1961]

Looks like you need lugnuts with the shank/sleeve that goes inside the lugnut hole on the wheel. Some have flat shoulders but others have tapered shoulders with the shank which is what looks like you need.(DON'T take my word as fact, make sure you get the RIGHT lugnuts.) Never take chances with the wrong lugnut, always be sure to get the correct lugnuts for the wheels. I rotate the tires on 10 or 15 cars a day and have been doing it for years. I've seen torque specs from 45 lbs to 160 lbs for factory wheels but once you install after market wheels that changes everything. I wouldn't go past the factory specs though because the size of the stud usually determines torque specs.

[Front Range]

Originally Posted by garyd1961

Looks like you need lugnuts with the shank/sleeve that goes inside the lugnut hole on the wheel. Some have flat shoulders but others have tapered shoulders with the shank which is what looks like you need.(DON'T take my word as fact, make sure you get the RIGHT lugnuts.) Never take chances with the wrong lugnut, always be sure to get the correct lugnuts for the wheels. I rotate the tires on 10 or 15 cars a day and have been doing it for years. I've seen torque specs from 45 lbs to 160 lbs for factory wheels but once you install after market wheels that changes everything. I wouldn't go past the factory specs though because the size of the stud usually determines torque specs.

Yeah I'd say you nailed it. 60 degree seat with the extended shank. I measured out everything and picked up these with the .61 wide shank - essentially the acorn with extended shaft. I've had the flat washer style and these are definitely the 60 degree seat type. I had the Big O Tire shop install the rims when I first got them and they selected the acorn with 60 degree and no extension but I think there is far to much gap between stud and rim hole for a plain un-extended acorn.

Appreciate all the advice.

[Front Range]

Stock 7/16-20 RH studs, on a 77K10. Rims are the old American Racing AR-21 Directionals, often referred to as sawblades.

[Gromit]

I have the OEM 15 x 6 steelies on my 1970 C-10 LWB (or was it 5.5 or 6.5?) - anyway judging by the date code on the wheels they are original to the truck.

About nine months ago I removed and touched up the outer parts of the steel wheels with spray paint and then reinstalled and torqued them with a click type wrench to 65 foot pounds (star pattern, very meticulous since I am one of these torque Nazis)..Service manual spec is 65 ft lbs. and the stud threads were wire brushed and carb cleaner sprayed clean and no anti-seize, oil or grease was used - just bare metal studs and clean degreased lugnuts. Lugnut needs to be turning when the torque wrench clicks, etc.

Anyway nine months later just last week I was trying out a spare wheel for fit and when removing the original wheel was very surprised to note that the lug nuts had loosened up... So I popped off the other three hubcaps and checked the rest of the lugnuts and they had all loosened.

By loosened I mean maybe to about 20-30 foot pounds from the 65 foot pounds that I had put them at.

The GM 1970 Service Manual said to check the lug nut torque every 6000 miles.. (after checking them at 100 and 500 miles after a change) Well there you go I waited nine months what did I expect?

Partly joking there but this is the first time I have seen a whole bunch of lug nuts loosen on their own. I have the six lug and drum brakes.

It is a heavy vehicle? My MBZ w126 is heavier but those MBZ lugnuts never loosen so I don't know..

Here are the relevant pages to the 1970 GM service manual pdf - I think this is the Lubrication section pages 0-18 and 0-19

[In The Ten Ring]

You know, my car does this (daily driver). It didn't used to but then it started all of a sudden.

I would use a torque wrench and set it for 90 ft-pounds for my lug nuts (Honda Accord).

About 4 years ago I was driving and began to hear a sound, like a rubbing sound. I pulled over and decided to check the lug nuts. ONE OF THEM NEARLY FELL OFF and all were loose. So I tightened them.

The shop has no idea (Honda shop) what is up. What I do now to fix this problem is after I rotate my tires (every 6K miles) I tighten snugly and then recheck for snugness every time I go on a drive, usually just a couple of miles. I'll do this for a day or so and then the lug nuts stay tight.

The new problem is that I end up with lug nuts so tight, I need a cheater bar to get them off again! I use a long 1/2" drive SK ratchet as my lug wrench and I carry a 3 foot long piece of chain link fence post in my car's trunk as the cheater bar.

After I get my truck running, I want to build a bed tool box from wood and carry the same thing (along with all the other goodies I refuse to drive without).

[garyd1961]

I have to admit something. I've been working at dealerships for years and always torque lugnuts to specs but I never checked the specs on my 70 C10. Thanks to Gromit I now know 65 lbs is correct but I always torqued them to 80 lbs. I have been using 80 lbs for over 10 years with no ill effects and will probably continue.

[dmjlambert]

Thanks for this thread. It prompted me to pop the hubcaps off and check. I have plain steel rims with the old dog dish hubcaps and standard lug nuts. They were loose after less than 100 miles.

[notsolo]

I think ( engineer_ gregh Original post ) is on to something, not to disregard all the other possibilities, cone shapes, flat wheel mounting surface etc. I bought new chrome lug nuts 20+yrs ago from western Auto, never thought a thing about it until I go to mount them, the threads are sloppy. Thread them on 1/2 way and see if there is any play wobble from stud to nut. this is a pretty serious part of our trucks, don't take a chance on inferior parts.

[davepl]

I bought myself a set of Torque Sticks for my impact gun but have so far always checked them with a torque wrench afterwards. They're always spot on - but having had the aforementioned wheel come off, I'm a little OCD and check them manually still.

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by davepl

I bought myself a set of Torque Sticks for my impact gun but have so far always checked them with a torque wrench afterwards. They're always spot on - but having had the aforementioned wheel come off, I'm a little OCD and check them manually still.

Spot on. Torque sticks are okay at best. I love the idea of them, and have used them myself, especially when i'm in a hurry. However, there's no time saved worth it when compared to the danger of a wheel coming loose. Wheel torque is often one of the most neglected things on a vehicle next to oil changes and tire pressure.

There is no supplement for a good torque wrench and an extra 5 minutes.

[davepl]

Originally Posted by leftybass209

Spot on. Torque sticks are okay at best. I love the idea of them, and have used them myself, especially when i'm in a hurry. However, there's no time saved worth it when compared to the danger of a wheel coming loose. Wheel torque is often one of the most neglected things on a vehicle next to oil changes and tire pressure.

There is no supplement for a good torque wrench and an extra 5 minutes.

Pretty sure that's -all- the big tire stores like Les Schwab use, and if there were any real risk, they simply wouldn't be able to as there would be too many bring backs, warped rotors, wheels falling off, and so on.

Like I said, I still check them, but I think it's redundant. I've never had the torque stick be wrong yet!

If nothing else it saves some work and prevents you over-shooting by trying to pre-tighten them with an impact.

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by davepl

Pretty sure that's -all- the big tire stores like Les Schwab use, and if there were any real risk, they simply wouldn't be able to as there would be too many bring backs, warped rotors, wheels falling off, and so on.

Like I said, I still check them, but I think it's redundant. I've never had the torque stick be wrong yet!

If nothing else it saves some work and prevents you over-shooting by trying to pre-tighten them with an impact.

Torque sticks are a wear item, just like impacts. Degradation is questionable as to the brand and longevity, but I've not only seen broken torque sticks, but I've had them very +-20ft.lbs. just like a torque wrench needs to be calibrated so often, torque sticks need to be checked for accuracy.

[davepl]

Originally Posted by leftybass209

Torque sticks are a wear item, just like impacts. Degradation is questionable as to the brand and longevity, but I've not only seen broken torque sticks, but I've had them very +-20ft.lbs. just like a torque wrench needs to be calibrated so often, torque sticks need to be checked for accuracy.

Tangential to this discussion, but not worth a new thread: does anyone know where you can take a Craftsman torque wrench to be recalibrated? Sears doesn't do them in house (ie: you can't just take it to the store last I checked). I'm overdue!

[In The Ten Ring]

Once in traffic on Independence Blvd east of Charlotte, NC (Matthews) I saw a pickup lose its driver's side rear wheel! It literally launched some 20 feet straight up into the air and came bouncing down, fortunately it didn't land on an other cars in traffic. The truck's hub sat down onto the pavement but the truck just pulled into some business entrance and stopped.

*The light turned green and I had to go forward, else I would have checked on things and offered my help.

[dmjlambert]

Today felt like a good day to check. Found one lug nut very loose on each of the front wheels, and tightened them up.

[ga-stepside]

Originally Posted by engineer_gregh

I've installed 20" Boss 338's on my longbed. Yesterday a guy pulls up next to me at a red light and informed me that my left front wheel looked to be loose. After I initially installed them I went back and checked for loose lug nuts at a couple of hundred miles and all was good. Now after 700-800 miles a couple of lug nuts were loose at all four corners. Anyone else have this problem with their over sized or after market wheels? This scared the crap out of me, the last thing I want is to experience losing a wheel at any speed.

Are you running front disc brakes? I have 338's on my '67 with '72 rotors. I just replaced the rotors and noticed right away the 338's will not seat on the hub unless you taper the end. I used a flapper on my angle grinder taper the ends. You don't have to take off too much.

[harpo231]

Just break it ,, then take to sears craftsman lifetime

[In The Ten Ring]

Originally Posted by harpo231

Just break it ,, then take to sears craftsman lifetime

The Craftsman we grew up with isn't the same one we have now. From what the clerk told me, the "lifetime warranty" did not include torque wrenches. If you can refute what that no-longer employed clerk said, I'd be happy to read it.

[71cheyennesuperlongb]

Just a question.Have you ever used anti-seeze on your lugs? The reason I ask is ,yes they will come off easier just not when you want.My best friend put his roadster together and we torqued the wheels on and went for a test ride. 20 miles later both front wheels worked loose to where a shimmy started.Stopped and checked and all 20 lug nuts were loose.I am not sure but I dont think you should even use light oil on the studs.

[dmjlambert]

I put the nuts on with no lube. It is good for this thread to come back up to the top. It's time for everybody to run out to the truck and check the torque on the lug nuts. I just found 1 loose.

[kyhillbilly]

I was driving my 1970 K10 and pulling a trailer with another full-size pickup on it and the driver's side rear wheel passed me! I pinched a hickey in the seat! A 2 lane country road and luckily no one was in the other lane!

[dmjlambert]

I'm glad you're OK. Or maybe you're not, I'm not sure what that pinched a hickey expression means. But I can imagine you considered being passed by your own rear wheel to be an emergency situation. OK everybody, it's time to go out to the truck and check the torque on the lug nuts.