Suggestions on What I've Got?

[spankbomb]

Directly to the axle.

[smashingchuck]

Originally Posted by spankbomb

Directly to the axle.

You're going to want to use a sleeve bag (Firestone f9000) for that application.

[spankbomb]

Basically, it would be preferable to go with sleeved bags vs. convoluted just because of the packaging aspect, correct?

[smashingchuck]

I'm not really sure what you mean by packaging, but the sleeve bag is preferred because it has the correct spring rate.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by smashingchuck

I'm not really sure what you mean by packaging, but the sleeve bag is preferred because it has the correct spring rate.

"Correct spring rate" for an 'on the axle' 1:1 mounting position.

[smashingchuck]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

"Correct spring rate" for an 'on the axle' 1:1 mounting position.

that's what I ment... thanks for clarifying.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by smashingchuck

that's what I ment... thanks for clarifying.

I knew you knew.... I just wanted to make sure they know what you knew. Know what I mean?

[LONGHAIR]

Yup........

[spankbomb]

So the Firestone is recommended because of spring rate, not for "packaging"? By packaging, I mean how much space the bag takes up. For example, the Conti bag needs 8.26" in diameter for installation space needed, which as of right now I haven't even checked to see if I have the space between the tire and rear frame rails.

I'll do that before going any further.

I do have questions about spring rate. Wouldn't the spring rate by variable by the amount of PSI? For example, at 40 PSI, the load rating would be 750 lbs with a spring rate of 381 lbs/in.

The bag info I'm getting from the link below. If you click on the "Schematic" link under the bag, it will give you the technical info:

http://www.arnottairsuspension.com/p...s.asp?catId=13

Spring rate could be different for each driver and situation, but I can't believe that my uses (mainly weekend cruising, maybe some autocross if I get crazy) of the truck would be different from many here.

What spring rates/PSI are you using and why? For that matter, what is the spring rate on the Firestone which are recommended?

Not trying to be difficult, but I became unemployed a few days after I started this thread and I'm trying to use/scrape together all of the parts that the PO had on the truck that will work and are in good condition for the direction I'm taking this project.

I do appreciate all of your input.

Thanks,
Jon D.

[spankbomb]

I finished the plates for the 4-link frame mounts last night. I'll be coming off of plates with 2" x 4" rectangular tube, 0.188 wall and welding the link brackets to the rectangular tube. Or, that's the plan at least right now.

[smashingchuck]

I'll give you the short answer on the air bag question. Basically, the bags you have are designed to support about 2,500 ponds a peice. The f9000 are rated at somewhere around 1000 pounds a piece.(these are ball park fugures here). So all in all, the f9000's are designed to hold up something lighter (like the rear of a truck) and the bags you haved are designed to hold up something heavier (like the fron of a truck).

Will it work if you choose to use the bags you have? Yes. But unless you plan on hauling around 2,000 pounds of gravel all the time, it's going to ride like crap.

If you insist that you use these bags, mount them to the bar in a lever set up. It will work great, and since you havent started yet it won't cost anymore money. You will however have to ditch the parallel 4 link and go to a different style set up...

[ShowSS12]

^^ unless you want do a 6 link.. Parallel 4 link pan hard or watts with some rear lift bars...

[72hotrodder]

just put the bags on the bars. gives a great ride and the extra lift will come in handy. and since your building the 4link anyways it wont be hard to do

[smashingchuck]

Originally Posted by ShowSS12

^^ unless you want do a 6 link.. Parallel 4 link pan hard or watts with some rear lift bars...

I figured since he was on a budget that putting the bags on the bars would be more economical than adding extra bars.

[bedsled71]

the bags you have will be fine.. i dont think it will ride like crap since alot of it has to do with psi in position to your ride height and the right shocks since shocks are what control the movement of the suspension while driving

[spankbomb]

Bringing this thread back. I've decided to go run a 4-link calculator and see what numbers I get. I do have a couple of questions, and was hoping to get some insight on some of my figures.

The ride height I'm shooting for is N2TRUX ride height, since his '77 has been some inspiration in the overall look I'm gunning for.

Wheelbase 117.5".
Final weight est. 3900 lbs. Anyone running LSx engines know what their trucks weigh in at? Also, if you've weighed each corner, that would be awesome, too, as I can then back into a more exact center of gravity.
Center gravity height I guesstimated at 24". Some of the research said to use crank height as an estimate. Since I don't have an engine yet, I used measurements others had taken.
Front and rear unsprung weight. I've estimated the rear 9" with disc brakes, the 17" Cragar soft 8s, p275/50r17s and assorted brackets/bags to weigh in at 400 lbs. The front, I'm not so sure. Anyone know what the unsprung weight of the 73-87 suspension components are? I guesstimated at 350, but I'm not sure if that is even close.

N2TRUX, what is the height of your rear LCA frame mount at ride height? I sure would appriciate it if possible.

Thanks in advance for the help.

Jon D.

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by spankbomb

.....The ride height I'm shooting for is N2TRUX ride height, since his '77 has been some inspiration in the overall look I'm gunning for.....
N2TRUX, what is the height of your rear LCA frame mount at ride height? I sure would appreciate it if possible.

First let me clarify that every pic I have ever posted with the exception of maybe one shows my truck "aired out" not at ride height. It will "roll" at that height, but is not drivable beyond idling through a smooth parking lot.

I think what you are after is a ride height that is similar to my aired out height. Lets clarify that before we go much further.

Your rear set up is going to take you much lower than mine because of the notch. The limitation I have in the rear is the bed floor. If you want your ride height equal to my aired out height, I will get those measurements.

[spankbomb]

Cool. I appreciate the help. The pics that I am looking at in particular are page 2 of the "DO NOT OPEN- Air Ride Technologies inside" thread.

Thanks,
Jon D.

[spankbomb]

I set up the rear axle at my target ride height (well, a little higher, but I mocked it up with the rear tire/wheel combo and subtracted the difference) and took measurements and plugged them into a four link calculator. Does anyone have experience working with the four link calculators? From my earlier research, a target would be 40-50% AS, but with taking more exact measurements of the truck at anticipated ride height, I couldn't get AS that low.



I also evaluated the PO's upper and lower rear control arms and think it is probably going to be quicker & easier to just build new ones than chopping up the old ones and trying to use them.

Here's how she sits tonight.



I'll be ordering parts this coming week.

Later,
Jon D.

[spankbomb]

So, parts began arriving this week after being ordered last week. I'm still waiting on one vendor to get me the brackets, tabs and poly bushings I ordered. Hopefully, they'll show up next week, but I was told last week they would ship this week (which they didn't).

I found these on eBay. Pair of Shockwave 9000s.



These are from Ruffstuff Specialties and I bought through Krawltex. The heims came with the jam nuts, tube inserts and misalignment spacers and the frame brackets are adjustable and threaded. These brackets will be used on the inner frame rail (after I box it) for the upper rear links.

[scotts62]

Very cool! Cant wait to see it all installed

[smashingchuck]

Cool. Are you going to run the shockwaves up front as well?

[spankbomb]

I stumbled across these on eBay.

I don't plan to run shockwaves up front, unless I can find them for $500 or less new like I found these. After adding up new bag brackets, shock relocation brackets, shocks, etc., I decided for a little more money I could have a lot more "cool factor."

[spankbomb]

I have my lowers burned in and the links built, but now I need to turn my focus on the upper links. Using those adjustable brackets above, anyone have any ideas on how I should do my upper frame mounts? How far would you box the frame? If I went with 1/8 inch and dimple died it would that suffice?

Keep in mind I'll still need access to the nuts on the back of my lower frame brackets since I made them boltable.

Your ideas are appreciated.

[smashingchuck]

I would box it from the links mount to the notch.