Extreme Drops

[PBFAB.COM]

Originally Posted by texastrendz

Driven everyday, everywhere, now that it is fixed. Just logged 1000 miles on it in about a month.

Love the dually Dan!

[texastrendz]

Hey thanks Nate, long time coming on this one. Thanks for all the help on it. Rides like a "Caddy" as they all say.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by texastrendz

Driven everyday, everywhere, now that it is fixed. Just logged 1000 miles on it in about a month.

This is the kind of drop I'm talking about puttin' some miles on guys. What was broke?

[texastrendz]

I had some issues with a convoluted bag over the axle in the rear. We installed some sleeve bags to help with ride quality. Up front i had some control arms built by a air suspension specialist, i thought, and they bent without me even driving the truck. Just cycling the suspension tweaked them pretty good. Then i had severe bump steer issues and front end geometry problems. Nate at porterbuilt helped me with all these issues and now is a daily driven truck. I cannot stress enough, go with the guys with the proven experience and knowledge.

[colin_havens]

Once I got my truck all together, I took it for a quick spin around town, about 5-10 miles. The next morning I left here at about 8 AM, heading to Millington, TN for a show. I put about 600 miles on the 67 that weekend, and grinned the entire time. On roads was very familar with, I drove it about a half inch off the pavement. Highway driving and unfamilar/rough roads i was a little higher, but not too much. If I cant drive it whenever I want, I will not have it. To be honest, my issue with my 67 is not if it is road worthy, its that I really need a quad cab so the entire fam can go with me.

[N2TRUX]

Welcome to the forum hellbounder.

[firedog]

my truck is a driver also (only on a trailer when its broken) love cruising around as low as i can in my truck... drove it to midwest all truck nats from stl to kc and back and i think it rides better on air then it did from the factory

[hellbounder]

Originally Posted by N2TRUX

Welcome to the forum hellbounder.

thank's ,ive been lurking for a while. just bought a 66' chevy long bed, that im keeping the farm truck look on.......but bagged at some point.

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by hellbounder

thank's ,ive been lurking for a while. just bought a 66' chevy long bed, that im keeping the farm truck look on.......but bagged at some point.

wheres the pics?

[csbatey]

driven daily 6/8

[hellbounder]

Originally Posted by N2TRUX

wheres the pics?

i'll post some soon, my computer has been running slow,and not wanting to download pics.

[Painter D]

I've daily driven extreme dropped trucks before with no problems, but now all of my nice stuff is trailered.





SCOTI , just out of curiousity why the interest in this particular subject? Are you planning on an altitude change on your dually?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by 69chevyshort

I've daily driven extreme dropped trucks before with no problems, but now all of my nice stuff is trailered.

SCOTI , just out of curiousity why the interest in this particular subject? Are you planning on an altitude change on your dually?

I purchased drop parts the 1st week I had the dually. Was there ever a doubt it wouldn't get dropped?
It won't be slammed.... just a mild 4/6 or 5/7 adjustment.

The topic in question was more of an information search. I've been trying to get my driveline put together for the 64 so I can get the cab/body swapped over. The standard on the 'extreme' drop vehicles seems to be limited road use (barhoppers, weekend cruises, annual local GG shows). With that type of limited use, 'issues' don't necessarily make much of an impact vs. a road warrior that might be driven 2K miles on a single trip.

I like to drive my stuff so it has to be 'right', not just good enough. As I've been getting info & quotes from driveshaft manufacturers, the common concern from them has been w/the driveshaft being on an incline from the trans to the pinion, there's going to be problems. I've spoken w/Mr. Porter w/my concerns & have his input. This was more for those that have been there & put the miles on their Dropmembered or Z'd set-up so I had 'real time' input.

I PM'd a couple of board members to discuss their set-ups & any related issues. Educating myself helps me make better choices.

[Painter D]

Gotcha

[bedsled71]

can you explain why there would be a problem with vibrations with the driveshaft on an incline since the vibrations are caused from the angles of the ujoints working aginst eachother? or is that not correct?

[6772owner]

I drive the s'not out of my bagged 72' C10, 3" drop front arms + the bags and ECE rear bag kit (apx 6-7" drop at the pressure I run) I do run 255/55/18's though....
Posted via Mobile Device

[GVizzle]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

I purchased drop parts the 1st week I had the dually. Was there ever a doubt it wouldn't get dropped?
It won't be slammed.... just a mild 4/6 or 5/7 adjustment.

The topic in question was more of an information search. I've been trying to get my driveline put together for the 64 so I can get the cab/body swapped over. The standard on the 'extreme' drop vehicles seems to be limited road use (barhoppers, weekend cruises, annual local GG shows). With that type of limited use, 'issues' don't necessarily make much of an impact vs. a road warrior that might be driven 2K miles on a single trip.

I like to drive my stuff so it has to be 'right', not just good enough. As I've been getting info & quotes from driveshaft manufacturers, the common concern from them has been w/the driveshaft being on an incline from the trans to the pinion, there's going to be problems. I've spoken w/Mr. Porter w/my concerns & have his input. This was more for those that have been there & put the miles on their Dropmembered or Z'd set-up so I had 'real time' input.

I PM'd a couple of board members to discuss their set-ups & any related issues. Educating myself helps me make better choices.

I think thats the whole point of doing things right the first time. I am confident with the PORTERBUILT Stuff I won't have any problems. After all thats what he designed his stuff for.

But maybe we can get a ride report from somebody who has a completed truck..............ANYBODY?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by GVizzle

I think thats the whole point of doing things right the first time. I am confident with the PORTERBUILT Stuff I won't have any problems. After all thats what he designed his stuff for.

But maybe we can get a ride report from somebody who has a completed truck..............ANYBODY?

Nate knows his way around a chassis for sure & I'm very confident in his recommendations. But, his set-ups (your truck & N2billets Hazel) are intended to use the 2pc driveline & he's in AZ. That's a long way from me (18hrs one-way) & a burden if there are problems.

I'm not planning to 'lay out' (will be 2.5" off the ground @ the lowest point/rear cab mount C/L) & the 6x-66's have more under-cab room so I was trying to do the 1pc. driveshaft. I've heard more than a couple horror stories of guys buying their driveshafts on-line/out of state from the industries finest only to have problems. I know of @ least 2 guys personally that used the provided 'tech' sheets to take their measurements only to get shafts that did not fit correctly. One of those guys, the majority of this board has drooled over his trucks so I'm pretty sure he knows how to read & understand a tech/dimensions sheet.

Being proactive, I figured I would try to use a local driveline service shop & make sure they agree w/the numbers & angles of my set-up. This gives me flexibilty w/them 'buying-in' to the project. If we arrive @ an issue, they're much more likely to assist in solving the problem vs. telling me it's screwed up because of this angle or that setting.

Since the industry guys are telling me the incline from the trans to the pinion is going to be an issue (Driveshaft Specialities of San Antonio & Inland Empire Driveline Service both have said this), I have to assume there's reasoning behind it that I'm not aware of or don't understand the physics of. Not being one to just 'settle' for answers of "you can't because it won't work", I research the info from guys that have similar combos to see how they did things & how well it's really working.

Take the input from 'real world' set-ups as well as what the specialists recommend & I should be able to get a problem free set-up. More info = educated decisions.

[GVizzle]

I agree 100%.

[PBFAB.COM]

Food for thought:

Lifted truck has a drive-line angle that slopes down towards the rear differential. What's the difference? There is none. The driveshaft has no idea that it slopes up or down. It just has to have operating angles that can co-exist in harmony.

The drive-line can be one of the more difficult aspects to set-up on a pavement pounder or lifted truck... but it can be done. Takes some careful measuring and a solid understanding of operating angles.

[bedsled71]

can you explain why there would be a problem with vibrations with the driveshaft on an incline since the vibrations are caused from the angles of the ujoints working aginst eachother? or is that not correct?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by bedsled71

can you explain why there would be a problem with vibrations with the driveshaft on an incline since the vibrations are caused from the angles of the ujoints working aginst eachother? or is that not correct?

Driveline vibrations can be caused by several different factors. From what I've learned: the operating angles are the primary culprit; then phasing, & then "secondary couple loads".

Secondary couple loads brief explanation from Greg Frick @ IEDLS: These loads operate at 90 degrees to the shaft. With equal and opposite angles these loads cancel out and are not an issue. When the angles are equal, but both on the same side of the drive shaft (the top in my case), they add up. The result of additive secondary couple loads is a shaking of the mounts: the transmission and the rear end. This shaking goes everywhere in the car and is very aggravating.

An odd feature of the secondary couple load problem is that the farther they are apart the less of a problem they seem to be. Unfortunately there is no rule on how far is far enough or how close is too close. What works in a '53 Studebaker will not work in a bucket T.

I have asked more than once for an explanation on the inclined driveshaft issue but haven't gotten any solid feedback. IEDLS has reference material that only states that is the one orientation to avoid. As far as I can tell, the main reason is because that configuration yields excessive working angles for the u-joints. Pages 3-4 explain some typical variations on driveline set-ups:
http://www.iedls.com/asp/admin/getFi...&TID=28&FN=PDF

[PBFAB.COM]

One thing we must all remember when dealing with "customized" and "altered" trucks, chassis, suspension, drive-trains, etc. is that there is no longer a perfect world scenario. If we were to drive vehicles that were set up according to spec. in its "perfect" form... they would no longer be appealing to us.

Once we have voided our factory warranty by modifying our ride, we must look at our game plan from a different angle (pun intended). We must find the compromise, that allows us to accomplish the MOST of what we want (sometimes we get lucky and accomplish ALL of what we want, but this is not always the case). This may mean that we get conflicting or unclear information from different sources... even professionals. Heck, I could go and see three different doctors for the same illness and be prescribed three seperate remedies! This is just how it goes. And why is it that whenever I call and talk to a wheel manufacturer that they can never tell me the backspacing I need... don't they make wheels and sell them everyday? Oh, they just don't want to be liable and responsible if it doesn't work out and the customer isn't satisfied.

Scoti- In your case, your driveline will always slope up in the rear... it's just going to be that way unless you raise your truck another 4"-6". So, what can be done? One real world solution I have recommended and used is a CV or Double Cardon Joint. This will allow the angles to cancel eachother out... no vibrations. I know your drive-line guys told you that's just a band-aid fix... but what other alternatives are there at this point? Maybe raise the truck? (Please don't take this wrong, as we are friends and we talk frequently discussing all sorts of truck related items... I am just using this scenario as an example).

[Mkcustums]

SCOTI -

I know this isn't a Chevy but the point still stands the same... I bought a Hardbody ('97) brand new with 3 miles on it. When it had only 794 it was in my garage on jack stands getting a static drop with the frame 2 1/4" off the ground, that's pretty low. Driveline was pointed up for sure! I put lots of trips on the truck around 700 miles or so with zero issues ever. Sold the truck with over 24k on it and the driveline nor u joints were ever replaced. And no the truck was not abused either, no dents, scratches, or stains. -The driveline angles might never be completely perfect but you can make it work. I think the driveline companies might be scaring you a little bit.

Like you said, do it right the first time and it will be just fine!

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by porterbuilt

One thing we must all remember when dealing with "customized" and "altered" trucks, chassis, suspension, drive-trains, etc. is that there is no longer a perfect world scenario. If we were to drive vehicles that were set up according to spec. in its "perfect" form... they would no longer be appealing to us.

Once we have voided our factory warranty by modifying our ride, we must look at our game plan from a different angle (pun intended). We must find the compromise, that allows us to accomplish the MOST of what we want (sometimes we get lucky and accomplish ALL of what we want, but this is not always the case). This may mean that we get conflicting or unclear information from different sources... even professionals. Heck, I could go and see three different doctors for the same illness and be prescribed three seperate remedies! This is just how it goes. And why is it that whenever I call and talk to a wheel manufacturer that they can never tell me the backspacing I need... don't they make wheels and sell them everyday? Oh, they just don't want to be liable and responsible if it doesn't work out and the customer isn't satisfied.

Scoti- In your case, your driveline will always slope up in the rear... it's just going to be that way unless you raise your truck another 4"-6". So, what can be done? One real world solution I have recommended and used is a CV or Double Cardon Joint. This will allow the angles to cancel eachother out... no vibrations. I know your drive-line guys told you that's just a band-aid fix... but what other alternatives are there at this point? Maybe raise the truck? (Please don't take this wrong, as we are friends and we talk frequently discussing all sorts of truck related items... I am just using this scenario as an example).

As I mentioned, I'm confident in your recommendation per our discussions. I also wanted a 'fudge' factor built-in so I have the ability (if possible) to adjust the angles just in case.

I currently have it set-up w/2.5° @ the trans & 2.2~2.4° down @ the pinion w/the d.shaft slightly sloping down. I haven't gotten over to the truck to measure & see how much material out of the floor this would require removing. This would be my alternative if the numbers we discussed (3° down @ tailshaft, CV @ trans, & as close to 0° @ the pinion as possible) doesn't work.