Another NV4500 to NP205

[obijuan]

advance adapter bell is worth it. I have it with hydraulic clutch in my 85 blazer. if you redrill the case you could end up like a guy on ck5 and the loctited torqued bolts could back out and cause catastrophic failure. unikely but would ruin it and turn it in to a terrible situation just to save a couple bucks.

I have the 32 spline flat flange with a ford superduty front driveshaft. It is 1350 spicer ujoints and a 4.25 bolt circle with the 2" pilot. fits almost any new flange out there nowadays and is very easy to find. Do some research on em but a new one can be had here locally for 400 built to your measurement. There are two different types. the rounded cv yoke ears is the ideal one.

sunsoaked, stock front yoke on the d60 is 1310 which is generally more than sufficient for most folks. but there aint no kill like overkill.

[sweetk30]

dana44 / corp 10 bolt and dana 60 front yoke at the diff are same size all 3 . only major thing to watch for is durring axle swap to dana 60 . pinion is bigger and sits back more . so check for drive shaft length so no bottom out problems.

[doubleclucker]

Orange Crate -
that thread link you posted is mine and just to let you know ol' Black is still driven everyday with no catastrophic failures lol
Any questions just ask on my thread also I have a front maxiumizer lsd and total dana 60 rebuild comin soon.
cheers

[Orange Crate]

Originally Posted by obijuan

advance adapter bell is worth it. I have it with hydraulic clutch in my 85 blazer. if you redrill the case you could end up like a guy on ck5 and the loctited torqued bolts could back out and cause catastrophic failure. unikely but would ruin it and turn it in to a terrible situation just to save a couple bucks.

I have the 32 spline flat flange with a ford superduty front driveshaft. It is 1350 spicer ujoints and a 4.25 bolt circle with the 2" pilot. fits almost any new flange out there nowadays and is very easy to find. Do some research on em but a new one can be had here locally for 400 built to your measurement. There are two different types. the rounded cv yoke ears is the ideal one.

sunsoaked, stock front yoke on the d60 is 1310 which is generally more than sufficient for most folks. but there aint no kill like overkill.

Thanks this info is much appreciated. I was looking at Denny's and other custom made 1350 CVs. I seriously doubt that I will ever need 1350 joints but the rest of the drivetrain is all 1 ton so what the h3ll. It would be really nice to have the AA BH as it would save some time and hassle putting it all together. It sounds like the easiest route.

[Orange Crate]

Originally Posted by doubleclucker

Orange Crate -
that thread link you posted is mine and just to let you know ol' Black is still driven everyday with no catastrophic failures lol
Any questions just ask on my thread also I have a front maxiumizer lsd and total dana 60 rebuild comin soon.
cheers

Yes, thanks again for that post. I reread it the other day just for fun, so looking forward to your D60 work. I rebuilt mine before I stuck it under the truck. Good work there on your set up, those are the ultimate option(s) I think. I've been in aviation for 30 years so I would definitely use safety wire like you did for the attachment hardware.

[snj8198]

How's this project going OC?

[Orange Crate]

Originally Posted by snj8198

How's this project going OC?

I need mo' money....!

[snj8198]

Haha!

[Orange Crate]

Since it is too cold to be in the garage I'd like to post an internet find here for the NV4500 assembly manual. I can not figure out how to reduce the file size any further than 1.2Mb (down from 3.4Mb) and the limit to attach here is 275Kb. If anyone wants a copy, PM me with your email and I'll send it that way. Sorry it is for a later 2001 Dodge version but you get the idea anyway right? I think what I will do is disassemble mine and then order just the bearings/parts that I feel need to be changed instead of buying a total rebuild kit like some vendors put together. As an example one vendor has a bearing kit that goes for around $330 and that includes what they call a small parts kit. I'll see what condition my parts are in first and then go from there to try to keep the cost down. I basically did the same thing on my NP205 and bough each bearing I needed separately and that allowed me to get good old made in the USA bearings at a little extra cost for the good stuff. I know I'll need syncros for sure already. Here is a tease shot since pictures are everything....

[Orange Crate]

I'm at the point where I need to remove the main shaft bearing and the counter shaft bearing to complete my NV4500 disassembly. What have you used to remove your bearings, short of ordering the factory tool pictured.? It seems to me that a normal bearing splitter might not work due to the small clearance between the bearing and the gear face (see arrow). I made a 5th gear nut wrench that worked perfectly. I had to stand on the end of the "wrench" that is 30" long and I'm 165lbs so that is somewhere around 300ft lbs. I cut up an old 32 spline long input shaft from an NP205 as the main shaft counter hold portion. It took me about six hours total to make both out of scrap steel I had in the shop. Recycle!

[Orange Crate]

Alrighty then. I got a cheap clamshell style puller online to see if it would work and it did for two of the three bearings. The one bearing it will not work on is the tapered roller on the forward side of the counter shaft. I'll cut that one off just to save time.

Here is the new puller in action. I had to use an old piece of DOM tube as a spacer since the one provided in the kit was too long. One thing that was really frustrating is that the new tool has no place to counter hold, to stop it from spinning. I may weld a couple of flats on there for future use. So both the main and counter shafts are completely disassembled now and they both look in really good shape. I can tell this NV has been overhauled at least once before as there are a few clues like silicon sealant and a few scratches on the shafts where the bearings reside. I'll need all new bearings and syncros and a new input shaft as that is toast. The splines are really worn where the clutch disk was riding and the stub nose where it joins the flywheel pilot bearing is also trashed. I just need to sell a kidney or something to get the rebuild kit.....

[sweetk30]

fyi that style puller needs the race set on the bearing to help it stay toghter when pulling off .

and if your doing gear setup adding & removing shims this fact is real important to not trash your new bearings .

[Orange Crate]

Yes, this kind of puller does trash your bearings, but they're OFF! and the new ones will be a lot easier to install, cool the shaft with dry ice and heat the bearing to about 350. No diff work just yet.

[sweetk30]

cause like I said you didn't set the race on the bearing first and set the rings up correctly .

if done right you can pull off and reuse as many times as you want .

also lube the heck out of the threads with copper anti-sieze .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUqSZelTSfI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkPPwfzD8Vg

[Orange Crate]

Oh, right, the outer race should be placed back on top of the bearing and then pulled. Don't really care at this point but thanks for the tip for future reference. These bearings need to be replaced anyway due to the wear patterns. I cut the counter shaft end bearing off earlier today so now I just need a bearing and small parts kit. Donations anybody? Ha.

[notchbackgta]

I am wanting to rebuild my NV4500 to save money too, I got the Kent Moore kit for the trans off ebay for a low price, but I can't find that tool you made for the rear bearing. I may have to think about making one like you did. I hadn't thought about making what I need.

[BDC1]

When you talk about the cast iron adapter are you referring to the four wheel drive tail housing of the nv4500? I finally picked up a round bolter and am plotting my attack. I didn't make quite the score of 200 dollars though.

Any updates on yours?

[Orange Crate]

Originally Posted by BDC1

When you talk about the cast iron adapter are you referring to the four wheel drive tail housing of the nv4500? I finally picked up a round bolter and am plotting my attack. I didn't make quite the score of 200 dollars though.

Any updates on yours?

Yes, but not much of an update. I saved a few dollars and just ordered a bearing and synchro kit plus a new input shaft. Should be here this week. That didn't take long...only 6 months of no beer or steaks on the grill.....now I really want a beer and a steak.....

[Orange Crate]

Not a lot of progress but some. I ordered a couple of different rebuild kits and some parts were missing. Mainly the idle gear needle bearings weren't the right ones in the needle bearing kit. I assembled most of the main shaft and have the counter shaft ready to install into the case as soon as the replacement needle bearings show up. The reverse idle gear and bearings are the first thing you put into the case and then the counter shaft and then the main shaft, so the missing idle gear bearings held up the whole show. To re-assemble I followed this thread here:
https://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/9...formation.html This guy actually assembled his NV4500 opposite of the pdf copy procedure I also have. (I can send anyone a copy if you send me a PM) the pdf is for a 2001 Dodge NV4500 manual, which has a synchro reverse gear (just skip that part if you have an early GM version). First pic is of the assembled main shaft. Second pic is the assembled input gear and front cover. Third pic is the carnage of scrap parts. I needed a new input shaft as the original was worn slap out. I also found damage on the 5th gear clutch cone, I'm not sure what happened there but it looked like someone had it in a vice and then installed it. There were blue burn marks from the displaced metal where it was riding on the synchro. Alrighty then..waiting on a big brown truck.

[Orange Crate]

Here is the stack up if anyone was wondering what they were looking at. 4th gear is the input shaft shown in the second pic in the previous post. 4th gear ratio is 1:1 so you just lock the input shaft to the main shaft and hit the gas baby! Still waiting on the big brown truck.....

[Orange Crate]

Some progress. My replacement reverse gear needle bearings showed up. The place I bought my parts from didn't charge me for them as they shipped the wrong kit the first time (for a 97 and up I have a 92). I installed the reverse idle gear and then shimmed the counter shaft which allowed me to finally put the assembled main shaft into the case and shim the end play for that completed unit. I ended up with .002" for the counter shaft and .004" for the main. I still need to install 5th gear and the new nut and torque that to about 270 ft lbs. Pics are from input side and output side. Alright it just has to warm up some as it was 20f in the garage....

[Orange Crate]

Well the trans is back together. I installed the 5th gear assembly and synchros plus the shift fork. I didn't seal any of the covers yet as it was too cold in the garage. If you look closely at this last picture you can see frost has formed! When it gets warmer I'll repaint the top cover and RTV the rest of the covers. For now that's an overhauled NV4500, all new bearings and synchros a new input shaft and a new 5th gear clutch. I guess it's time to buy the really expensive oil. I found this trans for $700 and have another $480 in parts. If I needed to do this again I think I would just order one from a rebuilder for a little more than I have into mine and be done with it.

[Wide Open]

I see your transmission doesn’t have the damper on the tail shaft. Is there any benefit to using one or can it be removed to save rotating mass without negative effect? Both of mine have the damper.
Yours is going behind your 406 correct?
Are you modifying the tailhousing adapter to accommodate the original shifter or going with twin sticks? It may have been mentioned earlier in the thread but I’m not seeing it using my phone. ����

[SunSoaked]

I could be wrong but...I did a lot of research on the damper because I have a few 4500's and they all have it. However, the info is conflicting. I read that the diesel applications used them due to thier use of "dual mass flywheels." I know for a fact that one of mine with the damper came behind a gas motor. So I'm not sure, it's already there so I'm just going to leave it be.

[Wide Open]

Yeah I haven’t been able to find solid answers either that’s why I thought I would ask. I have two; a 96 or 97 that came behind a 6.5 and an earlier one with the closer bolt pattern that I don’t know what it originally came behind. It did come with a shifter and shift knob that matches what I have in my 86. Both have the same 1st/low gear.