X or h pipe, your thoughts guys

[LockDoc]

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Yes, there is such a thing as drone. I had it at 60-65 miles an hour with the '67 Panel Truck, and it has an LS1 engine with Series 40 knockoffs. It also has 02 sensors so that applies here too. I didn't have to re-tune anything. My wife wouldn't ride in it any more until I fixed it. I haven't seen this mentioned in this thread, but I installed "J" pipes on it and cured it immediately.

You might try a set of "J" pipes. The guy at the muffler shop I go to had never heard of them. He couldn't believe what a difference they made in the exhaust sound after he got them installed..... Exhaust still sounds good, just no drone.

Chart below the picture to calculate the length you need.

They are just a pipe shaped like a "J", installed just behind the mufflers. They are capped at the end and the frequency bounces back and cancels itself out. You can't just make them any length and expect them to work. That's why I recommend doing some reading on them. I think mine are 23.5 inches long.
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Posted by another member:

When you look at LockDoc's chart you will see that lower the RPM the longer the tube. Those tubes really do work. The science is sort of cool. Basically they are a quarter wave and bounce wave back onto the incoming wave to cancel it out. RPM, temperature and other variables are at work but with a little adjusting/tuning you will get it and be pleased, I think.

Tim... I'm wondering if this whole thread belongs in one of those other forums.... Dunno'

LockDoc

[Molino]

Originally Posted by special-K

^^^ I don't expect any of that to apply here. BTW, what is an oxygen sensor?

Maybe start a thread in the Engines forum or Racing and Hi-Perf

You are right, if you don' know what an oxygen sensor is, none of it applies or matters. Point being , if you install a crossover there may be some jetting/tuning involved...
or not..
Russ

[custom10nut]

Many moons ago (like 20 years), I put an H-pipes setup on my truck. I was putting a whole new exhaust in anyway, so I figured, why not?
This was before the X-pipe craze came in.
The “balancing out pressures” theory is plausible, but with high flow mufflers, is the theory effective?
I can understand the “straight line flow of gasses” theory with the X-pipe
I don’t know about improving performance (I don’t have a hi po engine) but the H-pipe did improve the sound, and reduced the noise resonance in the cab.
I’m sure there’s a scientifical theory and places have studies, but I’m just making an observation here

[BCOWANWHEELS]

I bet 99 % have never run a x or h pipe whove given the opinions

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

I bet 99 % have never run a x or h pipe whove given the opinions

I've run ''H'' and ''N'' pipes. I have no experience with X pipes.

[Killer Bee]

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

I bet 99 % have never run a x or h pipe whove given the opinions

I bet 99% of those that have ran either have not ran both and none all on the same vehicle so what then?

no should give their opinion unless they have compared all three styles?

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

who cares about oxygen sensors

everyone with LT, LS, LSX, TBI, TPI, or any myriad of aftermarket EFI systems like FiTech, Holley, Edelbrock, etc.

this includes a very large portion of members vehicles on the forum, possibly even in this thread..

[special-K]

I said I haven't. But I do know what an oxygen sensor is. 67-72 GM trucks don't have oxygen sensors. Yeah, I know a whole lot of people swap late model engines/control systems that require them, but what does that have to do with your question? This is not an engine swap related thread. If they give the sound you need, then use one. But I think the performance aspect is more hype than anything else.

[Molino]

Quote. I said I haven't. But I do know what an oxygen sensor is. 67-72 GM trucks don't have oxygen sensors. Yeah, I know a whole lot of people swap late model engines/control systems that require them, but what does that have to do with your question? This is not an engine swap related thread. If they give the sound you need, then use one. But I think the performance aspect is more hype than anything else. Quote

An oxygen sensor and an air/fuel meter can be added to any engine. It is a valuable tool that will precisely tell you if your carburetor is adjusted correctly. It will also show if any changes or adjustments need to be made because of any changes down stream, ie. changes to the exhaust system etc. I was referring to this in my first post, and I am still wondering if going from factory exhaust to duals or from independent duals to a crossover, has anyone had to re jet their carbs or just do an adjustment? An oxygen sensor and an a/f meter will ACCURATELY answer these questions.
From everything I have read and people I have talked to, a crossover is always better than independent dual exhaust.

Ps this thread can now return to engine swaps and racing engines

Russ

[GASoline71]

Originally Posted by special-K

But I think the performance aspect is more hype than anything else.

I agree 110%!

Gary

[D.PASSMORE]

I've never ran a H pipe. I was told by more that a few folks that it would take away from low end torque for pulling and hauling. But, I'm going to try one on my Blazer when I put the new exhaust system in this year.

[BCOWANWHEELS]

who cares about oxygen sensors

['68OrangeSunshine]

Just a seat-of-the-pants observation -- but when I got crossover exhaust on my 292, I noticed more torque. And it seemed to climb hills better. Granted the 292 L6 is already a torque monster, but this was more.

[Mike C]

I had a cat back exhaust on an ‘84 Corvette made by Magnaflow. It had an “H” or balance pipe between the two banks. Compared to the stock exhaust, it dramatically reduced the drone that C4 cars had between 1600 & 2000 rpm.

What is interesting about that setup it is just AFTER the singe monolithic cat which one would have thought acted just like a balance pipe since the engine pipes merged together then entered the converter then split into the individual mufflers. But even in that combo the H pipe reduced drone.

That was a fairly long pipe at about 18”. My ‘69 Camaro has one that was put on in the 80’s and is about 10” long where the pipes come in close to run down the driveline tunnel. Car has Flowmasters on it and IMO, it is one of the best sounding cars I have heard with 40 series mufflers. Not sure if mufflers changed over time, these were bought in ‘85 and were one of the first sets I had even seen.

I have a Pypes setup for my ‘64 Corvette waiting for the 427 install that is an X. Will be interesting to see how that works and sounds.

I would put one in if you have a large pipe performance exhaust system and packaging it in your vehicle is easy enough. I elected to NOT put one in my Jimmy because packaging is a PITA with the short wheelbase and transfer case. Jury is out on my short step but will make that call when it is at the exhaust shop.

[Ironangel]

"Pipes right, J's left" "Dave's not home!" "He took the "H" pipe and flushed it with the X's...I hung iron for 40 years so I could kick back and restore a couple of 72 C/10's, one to tow the one that goes. They both sport my hand made (and engineered) custom duels with matched Thrush turbo mufflers. The last thing I want to do is tie my duels together in an attempt to make them quieter or to scavenge a trivial performance gain. I can read the plugs, hear the motors breathing and change that zinc laden life extending oil often..."Aint no trash in my trailer" and no computerized rollers in my stable either..."Puff puff, pass pass" "Nasty Sally" did get a new 500HP mill last week." Cheers!

[special-K]

Yeah Mike, one reason I've never entered the world of crossovers, other than no one did when I got started, is I mostly run 4wds. Usually lifted, too. I also think of frame flex on a 4wd and a crossover. I also like as few welds as possible on my exhaust since that's where they commonly fail. I had bought headers, mufflers, and an H-pipe to do an exhaust on my '67 project. I decided to sell it because I'll be getting a custom system built. So I guess my '67 will have a crossover.

[BCOWANWHEELS]

every bit adds up

[bigsnookmaster]

I have ran both. H pipe first and X pipe for the last 25 years. Once you go there , you won't go back!

[tim_mc]

This from SuperChevy:
X-pipes and H-pipes Add Easy Horsepower, but Which is Best for Your Ride?
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/exh...for-your-ride/

[Killer Bee]

^ something around the end of the first paragraph of that article sounds vaguely familiar

[special-K]

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

^ something around the end of the first paragraph of that article sounds vaguely familiar

My point is not to argue the scientific fact, it's to ask how significant that fact is, and I don't think much at all. Dual bank exhaust of larger diameter than stock single exits more gasses and with a crossover it's a tiny bit more. Also factor in that custom dual exhaust designed for better flow, not just two pipes instead of one. So, not balanced flow throughout the 720* rotation? Some gases get lost for a moment each rotation that occurs a couple thousand times per minute. At 1200 rpm that's 20x per second, right? Not much time to get very lost. And lost? Aren't the gases still in the one and only pipe they entered? Doesn't the next pulse push the "lost gases" right out a 20x split second later? I notice a constant flow from my tailpipe. The only time such performance gain matters in (my) real life is on the drag strip where open individual pipes rule because it's wideass open throttle-only. I guess road course racing is closer to real life, just more throttle. It could make a difference there.

This thread is like a carburetor thread. Do what suits you. One will work better for some while the other works well for others. For me crossovers are to give desired exhaust note. At least I feel that is all I will ever notice. I can't imagine H or X making much difference either way. I would think the X would flow slightly better.

[BCOWANWHEELS]

I,am doing 2.5 pipes and considering 3 in h pipe close to end of trans

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

I,am doing 2.5 pipes and considering 3 in h pipe close to end of trans

Why the larger size for the 'H' section?

[BCOWANWHEELS]

Flow

[72c20customcamper]

X pipe for pure power better scavenging. But for best sound nothing beats a straight pipe to the glass packs with a healthy cam. Just sounds impressive. Yes you lose hp and torque but the sound pure heaven

[Killer Bee]

cherry bombs!