Headed to court again...for restoring classic trucks!

[Ironangel]

First of all, This sucks brother! Secondly,and without knowing any case details,Id push it ALL the way to the states highest court and beyond if necessary! Its been dismissed out one lower court already, all they want is their payoff via scare tactics through their so called district courts due process! Liquidate and put your money where nobody can find it and prepare for the real battle. When you beat them they will come after you from a direction you never anticipated! And know that they are reading this thread! They suck and do more harm to America and to her citizens than all the combined so called enemies outside our borders!

[Old Yeller 1970]

Sorry to hear about your situation. You aught to be free to sell what you want. Situations like yours is one reason why I live in the the middle-of-no-where podunk West Texas.

[suville]

Frank, it perplexes me that they target guys like you and Wess but given the current state of financial affairs its no surprise they will do anything and all things in their power to collect revenue. Sorry to say but they go after the producers not the bottom feeders unfortunately its not feasible to pack it up and move but boy could we use you over here in Idaho! Wishing you all the best in your battle! Might be time to vote with your feet! Got lotsa room over here!

[Twisted78SS]

Frank,

ETsC10 could not have said it better! and it reflects my sentiments exactly.

Anything we can do, please let us know!


Quote'

Frank that sucks big time!

I mean---you're off in the boondocks, keep a low profile, have your
second hand dealer's license, have documentation for the rigs...
...what the H??!!! do they want??

If there's anything I can do...(and I'm sure many of our other local
board members feel the same way)...I will write letters, show my
support in court, whatever......just say the word!

For Gods sake---we're talking 40 year old parts here!

[sbc383rulz]

best of luck in a bad situation, if you need signatures i can come up with a few after i get back from Iraq. its amazing how the government in WA goes after small business'. good luck and let me know any way i can help.

[PICKMUP]

Thanks for the great support! I am not looking for sympathy, but rather issuing a warning that authorities are increasing pressure on auto hobbyists, collectors and restorers. It threatens our very existence. Please don't make this about politics, but rather about our protection. The politicians can be our best allies to stop this. They can pass laws, we can't.
I am a member of SEMA and they provide good updates on actions in each state. They do not fight individual battles.
There is no problem with my neighbors. I am located on several rural acres, completely surrounded by heavy tree buffers and many of them are building cool rides too. The county actually allows "active restoration" of classic vehicles in our area, without limits.
The problems are coming from the state, as mentioned. They are increasing enforcement of these wrecking yard license requirements for restoration and parts...and their fines are soaring. They have elected to not recognize these county jurisdictions and act as if they don't exist.

[highperf4x4]

Originally Posted by neba

and what is the rest of the story? are you out in the country or in a residential area? how close are your neighbors? do you have a few trucks or 20 parked on the front lawn?

You Paul Harvey?

Originally Posted by PICKMUP

Thanks for the great support! I am not looking for sympathy, but rather issuing a warning that authorities are increasing pressure on auto hobbyists, collectors and restorers. It threatens our very existence. Please don't make this about politics, but rather about our protection. The politicians can be our best allies to stop this. They can pass laws, we can't.
I am a member of SEMA and they provide good updates on actions in each state. They do not fight individual battles.
There is no problem with my neighbors. I am located on several rural acres, completely surrounded by heavy tree buffers and many of them are building cool rides too. The county actually allows "active restoration" of classic vehicles in our area, without limits.
The problems are coming from the state, as mentioned. They are increasing enforcement of these wrecking yard license requirements for restoration and parts...and their fines are soaring. They have elected to not recognize these county jurisdictions and act as if they don't exist.

Put me on the list of names if there's something to sign. I think it sucks royally.

[VA72C10]

Sorry to hear about this and thanks for the warning for the rest of us.

[PICKMUP]

Brief update---I promise brief!
It was a grueling two days in the court hearing. Lawyers argued legal language technicalities. You know, IS IS or IS IS not IS type symantics.
1. The AG's case was: There was a used part sold-that's a violation and the fine should be MAX!
2. The WSP officer testified that sometimes a person CAN sell their parts and other times they must have a wrecker license. He doesn't have any specific standards or rules. He decides when that action becomes "commercial" and he does not issue warnings.
3. The high ranking DOL official that decides whether to process an action against a person, also testified that some persons CAN sell their parts without a wrecker license. There are no standards or rules to determine when or how much. She decided the pics of my home with trucks & parts looked well organized, with like-items stacked together, like a wrecking yard would have.
4. The judge will take a few weeks to decide...
I will let you know.

[dirtball]

Originally Posted by PICKMUP

She decided the pics of my home with trucks & parts looked well organized, with like-items stacked together, like a wrecking yard would have.

I am sure her pantry has like items stacked together, like a grocery store would have.

[Musclerodz]

Originally Posted by dirtball

I am sure her pantry has like items stacked together, like a grocery store would have.

brilliant

[nickp51chevy]

From what I'm understanding is; if you want to have a bunch of trucks in your yard for parts or future projects, have them speratic on your property as to not resemble a wrecking yard. Organization leads to problems.

[67vetteal]

OK, I have been having a Manhattan, enjoying a fire and watching the snow fall. It's at times like these that I think the most clearly. So here goes. Hopefully the Judge will realize you are a hobbiest from your photos. Civil Liberties provide for "The Pursuit of Happiness.". Case closed! Our trucks make us Happy. D&%#* Bureaucrats! Good Luck/Fortune to you my friend!
Al W.

[meyer4589]

Same thing happened to my Uncle this past summer. He got busted for supposedly running a scrap yard in his backyard. He restores Oldsmobiles as a side job, and the neighbors were complaining about the three parts cars in his back yard so they reported him to the village he lives in

[Todersauce]

An old deputy taught me a trick that he learned on the job about selling items for security for personal safety. He would load up what ever he was selling in his truck and meet the buyer at a store or lot some place because he didn’t want anyone to know where he lived or what he had in or around his home. I have tried to use this as well because I have tools and parts that I want to keep. Nothing like inviting a thief into your home to scope out you're belongings. Sounds like this is one more situation to add to the list of why not to sell items from my house, if they don’t know they can’t tax or fine me. This obviously won’t help you but some one else might use it.

Hope you’re cleared and continue life as normal so I can come buy parts from you.

[mr48chev]

Not a bad idea for anyone thinking about selling parts that doesn't want who knows who knowing where he lives or what he has.

If I sell something I usually take it to work with me and have the buyer meet me there or at the mini market a quarter mile away.


One of Frank's big problems is that he is very close to the State Capitol and all the main offices for the various government departments that he is having to deal with.
A few minutes to take a jaunt out by his place and see if they can make an easy catch on a legit guy who is just trying to help someone out on a driver quality truck. You can almost bet that they sent "the new guy" in the office too.

Frank, I'd think that if you had clear titles in your name to the rigs that you owned and had as future projects it would serve as pretty good proof that you weren't running a side business of junking them out.

Producing a photo of the shiny brand new bumper on your truck that you pulled the old one off might be a plus too. They might not comprehend the difference between pulling off a "driver quality bumper" to replace it with a "show quality bumper" and then selling the driver quality bumper to someone who claimed he didn't have the money for one of your new ones off the rack in the showroom or back room. Liken it to one of them selling their old 27 inch TV to someone who could use it because they bought a new 40 inch lcd flat screen from Costco and the old one was still good enough for someone who you thought couldn't afford a new one to use.

[Huck]

Can you provide pictures and bills of sale of restorations that you do? Examples of your "restoration business"might sway the Judge.
Did the pictures of the neatly placed items have any signs including prices? Do they have any evidence of pricing sheets or advertising? Are you listed in the yellow pages as a salvage business? Did the part purchased simply reflect an excess item from a restoration? If someone does "small engine repair" such as lawn mowers or lawn tractors--if they have an extra part from a repair and someone askes if you would sell it to them for their classic cub cadet lawn tractor---is this a salvage yard?
You need numbers----numbers of others who do classic restorations---John Deere tractors, old cub cadets, motorcycles, ---can you engage some car clubs to show up in the court room---if you filled the court house with people and signs----I think the judge would throw the charge out of court. If you are the Lone Ranger---it will cost you a bundle and the odds are you will probably loose.
Why not create a quick list of all our local board members--and ask them to come show their support---I think you might be surprized at how many guys will find the time to break away and come stand by your side---win or loose---it will make a big difference to you and to the court. Create a phone list with each guy promising to call 4-5 others--and before you know it----everyone within 50 miles will be aware and supportive. Can't hurt. Good luck---Huck

[nad24LA]

Lets try and keep politcal statements to a minimum...or statements that can be taken that way. Thanks

[special-K]

I have my parts organized and placed with like items,but don`t sell.It`s known as organized and appreciated by all "thinking" types with no other motives up their sleeves.What the common decent folk don`t appreciate is the opposite.Restoration is legal as long as you`re not organized?The best restorations come from an organized effort.But,what would a bunch of hob-nobbin`Hush Puppy wearin`pencil pushers know about that?Maybe we need to start petitioning their hobbies...such as poking their snouts in the business of others.What happened to the right to privacy?You`re in a private setting.

[nad24LA]

You said it! It sound sounds like this WSP officer hasn't had P@#!%y since it had him. Or maybe he don't like girls.

[Hubscrub]

Originally Posted by special-K

I have my parts organized and placed with like items,but don`t sell.It`s known as organized and appreciated by all "thinking" types with no other motives up their sleeves.What the common decent folk don`t appreciate is the opposite.Restoration is legal as long as you`re not organized?The best restorations come from an organized effort.But,what would a bunch of hob-nobbin`Hush Puppy wearin`pencil pushers know about that?Maybe we need to start petitioning their hobbies...such as poking their snouts in the business of others.What happened to the right to privacy?You`re in a private setting.

Amen brother hope all goes well for you for the sake of you and the rest of us common folk

[OARNGESI]

Just curious is the main issue with selling the parts or dismantling trucks

[Sublvr72]

This thread is an interesting read, good luck. Can't wait to see what the end result is.

[LEEVON]

I wish you the best of luck. Fight, fight, fight. Sadly these kind of laws have no effect on neighbors like mine, they have 40 acres full of 50+ years worth of relocated buildings, scrap, vehicles, you name it. Been hauling a semi load/month for 2 years and barely making a dent. None of my business really and I would never complain to anybody but I would be happy if all they had were a few choice vehicles that had a PURPOSE.

Is this a business thing or a storage thing? It seems to be motivated by business/tax laws..?

[jerry moss]

good luck on this Frank, it's real sad when it's illegal to have a hobby like our trucks. that cop must have been really bored and a real a$$hole on top of it all. my cousin and myself used to part out 67-72s at the house my aunt and uncle owned, even the though the street is lined with houses it is zoned commercial and we were never bothered by the authorities-we had no license and had as many as 30 trucks at a time in the back yard. i guess it helped that we sold parts to all the local law enforcement officers with 67-72 trucks. one officer lived directly across the street but he was into trucks too.
again, i wish you the best of luck. i hope they throw all the charges out and let you get back to your normal life.