47-55.1 Eliminate draft tube options

[dsraven]

yep, good point. for a lurker hiding in the weeds though......

[mr48chev]

Back in the 70's a buddy of mine built his own engine stand to hold up the 426 Hemi out of his Roadrunner. He drilled the bolt pattern of the bellhousing mounting surface of the block on a piece of 1/2 inch steel plate that was big enough to cover the back of the engine and then welded a piece of heavy structural pipe to it to stick in the stand. He had a cut out for the crank. Rather crude looking but he was the best welder in town and it was strong.

If you were to take a piece of 1/2 inch plate ( I don't think 3/8 is strong enough). you could cut out the inside of the pattern of the back and drill the holes in the right spots to bolt it to the block and then drill 4 holes on the corners of the plate to bolt to the arms on the stand. That would probably take going to the scrap yard that sells remnant pieces rather than the steel yard.

[dsraven]

a lot of engine stands place the pivot point, where the tube is that goes into the actual stand, fairly close to the crankshaft. that may be ok for a V8 or a small inline but these engines are tall and heavy. that means there is a lot of weight above the crank so the engine always wants to rotate that heavy top section towards the bottom or try to topple the stand over. most of the el cheapo deluxe engine stands are not that wide at their base, really, so I recommend to be carefull with your design and ensure you have a little help when you rotate the engine on the stand, it can easily get away on you and you could end up with the engine on the floor, or worse , it could grab you on the way down. maybe working on it while on the hydraulic table wouldn't be a bad thing after all. if placing it on a stand try to get the pivot point as close to the balance point on the engine as possible. remember that when the head goes back on it will get even heavier and top heavy.
I'm sure you have thought of all this stuff but I can say from experience that the last 235 I had on a stand I realized how stinkin heavy those old inliners are. my engine stand is incorporated into a leg on the corner of my heavy steel workbench and has a slip in "foot tube" to help take the weight of the engine. I have had many engines on that stand but that 235, wow, it fought the weight of the workbench like a seesaw. i had to add some bracing and work more carefully for sure.

[dsraven]

any updates on the engine, engine stand, work in progress?

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by dsraven

any updates on the engine, engine stand, work in progress?

The engine is out and I've been cleaning it up a bit. I'm about ready to remove the valve train, pull the push rods and lifters out, so that I can pull the cam shaft to get to the front timing plate. I want to media blast the timing plate to clean it up before painting it with high temp engine paint. I thought about getting it powder coated, but don't think it would hold up with the engine heat.

In the meantime, I called my engine builder new friend and he managed to contact Covid while in the ER with his wife around the New Year. She is recovering slowly and given his age, so is he. When we spoke, he asked me to give him two weeks to get back on his feet. I'm going to check in on him this coming week.

I've also been using this time to re-do some of my original tasks (wiring harness and brake lines) since while removing the engine, I realized I may have over complicated a few things. So I'm cleaning those items up.

As it turns out Santa decided to deliver me a late Christmas present. He heard that I like Chevy's and decided maybe the 1953 truck needed a modern garage-mate. Funny thing about Santa, he still made me pay for the gift. LOL

[unclebrad]

Originally Posted by TX3100Guy

Attachment 2329782

As it turns out Santa decided to deliver me a late Christmas present. He heard that I like Chevy's and decided maybe the 1953 truck needed a modern garage-mate. Funny thing about Santa, he still made me pay for the gift. LOL

Attachment 2329784

Woof.

[leegreen]

dammmm, you must been a really good boy!

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by leegreen

dammmm, you must been a really good boy!

I had to sell some of my other toys to afford this, as my wife reminds me “a guy can only play with so many toys at one time”. My toy budget for the next ten years has now been spent or so I’ve been told. LOL

[dsraven]

sooo-eeet!

[Stepside Jim]

I'm just checking in for the first time, just clicking on the last page. Is the Corvette the one with the road draft tube issue?

[dsraven]

haha, if it was me i would be driving so fast I would have to keep both hands on the wheel and wouldn't be able to reach the window switch to close the window. it would be drafty. haha

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by Stepside Jim

I'm just checking in for the first time, just clicking on the last page. Is the Corvette the one with the road draft tube issue?

Now that is funny!

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by dsraven

any updates on the engine, engine stand, work in progress?

Ok, I have a bit of a short update and then, as usual, a question.

I've removed the valve train, then removed and kept track of the position of both the push rods and lifters. They all look relatively pristine, given that the previous owner had the engine completely rebuilt before he ever got to run it......fast forward fifteen years and I've run it for maybe a total of ten hours, if that.

My questions is now that the push rods and lifter have been removed how do I remove the cam shaft?

[leegreen]

two retaining bolts you can get to through those holes?

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by leegreen

two retaining bolts you can get to through those holes?

I thought those bolts held the timing cover front plate on. You're suggesting that they in some way retain the cam shaft?

I'll give that a try in the morning. Thank you.

[dsraven]

first, ensure the fuel pump is out or the cam will be held back by the fuel pump drive
second, ensure the lifters are all out so they don't interfere
third, check the timing marks so you know how they line up
fourth, turn the engine over so the holes in the cam gear line up with the bolts that hold the cam thrust plate onto the block. the thrust plate is on the cam before the gear is pressed on, along with a small spacer so the cam gear bottoms out on the spacer before it bottoms out on the cam gear and makes zero tolerance
fifth, remove the bolts that retain the thrust plate
6th, carefully pull the cam out while supporting it so as not to mark the cam bearings

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by dsraven

first, ensure the fuel pump is out or the cam will be held back by the fuel pump drive
second, ensure the lifters are all out so they don't interfere
third, check the timing marks so you know how they line up
fourth, turn the engine over so the holes in the cam gear line up with the bolts that hold the cam thrust plate onto the block. the thrust plate is on the cam before the gear is pressed on, along with a small spacer so the cam gear bottoms out on the spacer before it bottoms out on the cam gear and makes zero tolerance
fifth, remove the bolts that retain the thrust plate
6th, carefully pull the cam out while supporting it so as not to mark the cam bearings

Excellent points.
First - not using a mechanical pump, I have an under bed tank with an in-tank pump
Second - lifters and push rods out and in numbered slots in original order
Third - timing marks lined up and marked with a white oil paint pen
Fourth - I will line up the bolt heads tomorrow, although from memory I think at least one of them is already lined up
Fifth - will do this in the morning
Sixth - I've never done it myself, but have watched multiple cams removed (on all my car TV shows of course)

Thanks to both you and Lee for pointing out the obvious (but not to me).

[dsraven]

when you have it all apart and clean I recommend using a long strip of course sandpaper, like the ones used for autobody work, on a hard flat surface, like a strip of 3/4" plywood, to clean the gasket surfaces. a roloc disc is used by a lot of guys but if you aren't careful they can easily remove material from the block and, especially on a head gasket surface, can make for a possible head gasket leak. I have a strip of plywood cut a little shorter than the sandpaper, so the paper can be bent around the ends of the plywood and staped on. I use 80 grit paper for gasket surfaces but I run the paper over a sharp edge of something first, before I use it on a surface, to remove the "high spots" of grit so as not to groove the actual gasket surface. to get the surface ready first, like to clean off any hard to remove old gasket that could be remaining, I use an old 1 1/2" wood chisel with a clean sharp edge and no burrs on the edge.

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by dsraven

when you have it all apart and clean I recommend using a long strip of course sandpaper, like the ones used for autobody work, on a hard flat surface, like a strip of 3/4" plywood, to clean the gasket surfaces. a roloc disc is used by a lot of guys but if you aren't careful they can easily remove material from the block and, especially on a head gasket surface, can make for a possible head gasket leak. I have a strip of plywood cut a little shorter than the sandpaper, so the paper can be bent around the ends of the plywood and staped on. I use 80 grit paper for gasket surfaces but I run the paper over a sharp edge of something first, before I use it on a surface, to remove the "high spots" of grit so as not to groove the actual gasket surface. to get the surface ready first, like to clean off any hard to remove old gasket that could be remaining, I use an old 1 1/2" wood chisel with a clean sharp edge and no burrs on the edge.

First, the good news. The cam shaft is out of the engine cleanly.

The not so good news (so far) is that one of the flush screws that hold the timing plate is being resistant. The two on the right came out without much fuss. The one on the left is still in. I've soaked it from inside the opening to the crank with PB Blaster and hope that over night is loosens up. It is the last thing holding the timing plate on.

[dsraven]

heat the screw head with a torch, like the hotest torch you have or can borrow-oxy/acetylene would be great, so it heats the screw head fast but not the surrounding area and then leave it until the whole area is cold. then get a large flat screwdriver blade with no handle, just the blade part, and place that in the slot in the screw head. the alternative is a large flat screwdriver that you can plut a wrench on the shank or an adjustable wrench on the flart blade.hold that with a vice grip or the wrench if applicable and then hammer it a few times. don't smash it, just hammer it a few times. after a couple of hits put some torque on the bit with the vice grips or wrench and hit it again with the hammer as you try to turn it. it may have been locktited in place or installed with an impact screwdriver because the engine builder wouldn't want it to come out by itself and cause disaster. if that doesn't work try heating it again and use the same method asap while it's still hot. worse case scenario drill or grind the head off carefully. I have had some luck with welding a nut onto things like that but it is not easy to get a good weld when down inside a small nut bore

[leegreen]

I'd try one of these old school impact drivers, had good luck with them and screws:
https://www.amazon.com/CRAFTSMAN-Imp...dp/B07R96M9VW/
twist as hard as you can then wack it with a hammer

If that fails and heating is required, I'd focus on the edge of the plate near the screw head to expand the hole around the head, or general heat of the block as close to the screw as I could.
By the time you reach for the drill you know your havin fun

[dsraven]

i think I know the style of impact screwdriver you are talking about LG, I have 2 of them and they work well. i couldn't get the link to work. I think the screws are too close to the crank gear to fit the socket that holds the srew driver bit, unless the crank is out I suppose. thats why I mentioned to use a screwdriver and a vice grip, same theory. I have had good luck with the method I mentioned, even on really big bolts found in the heavy duty equipment world and especially on bolts that were loctited in place. of course if there is room to heat the block in the area then that works well too but I hate to use spot heat on cast iron because sometimes the iron can crack around the heated area due to uneven heating.
one thing I wonder about is whether the crank can be removed with the plate still on. if so, check and see if there are dowels holding the plate as well, for lining the plate up in a certain spot. if not, and there is only a single screw holding it, possibly the plate could be rotated slightly and that may also start to turn the screw head. not sure whats on the backside of the plate so dunno if that would work.
I have found that heating the head of the screw/bolt and allowing to cool seems to work most of the time. I think the theory is that the screw expands fastee than the block and then shrinks a little smallee than it was before. like welding sheet metal and seeing how it shrinks when it cools. that seems to break loose any rust or loctite. then striking it several times helps even more and using torque while striking will usually do the job. worth a try if you don't have an impact screwdriver
try this link for an impact screwdriver
https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-2905-8.../dp/B000NPPATS

[TX3100Guy]

Originally Posted by dsraven

i think I know the style of impact screwdriver you are talking about LG, I have 2 of them and they work well. i couldn't get the link to work. I think the screws are too close to the crank gear to fit the socket that holds the srew driver bit, unless the crank is out I suppose. thats why I mentioned to use a screwdriver and a vice grip, same theory. I have had good luck with the method I mentioned, even on really big bolts found in the heavy duty equipment world and especially on bolts that were loctited in place. of course if there is room to heat the block in the area then that works well too but I hate to use spot heat on cast iron because sometimes the iron can crack around the heated area due to uneven heating.
one thing I wonder about is whether the crank can be removed with the plate still on. if so, check and see if there are dowels holding the plate as well, for lining the plate up in a certain spot. if not, and there is only a single screw holding it, possibly the plate could be rotated slightly and that may also start to turn the screw head. not sure whats on the backside of the plate so dunno if that would work.
I have found that heating the head of the screw/bolt and allowing to cool seems to work most of the time. I think the theory is that the screw expands fastee than the block and then shrinks a little smallee than it was before. like welding sheet metal and seeing how it shrinks when it cools. that seems to break loose any rust or loctite. then striking it several times helps even more and using torque while striking will usually do the job. worth a try if you don't have an impact screwdriver
try this link for an impact screwdriver
https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-2905-8.../dp/B000NPPATS

Forgot i had an impact screw driver hidden away. A little bit of heat from a propane heat tool that I have and one good smack with the impact screw driver and the screw came out easily. Now off to clean it up. Thank you to everyone.

[TX3100Guy]

Here is a better view of the cracked crank shaft end cap.



And a before and after picture of the timing plate after some cleaning.

.

[Hcb3200]

This thread is more of a build thread now that is lots and lots of tangents. The title is a bit misleading. I would change the title to something more as to what this thread has morphed into. That way when others are searching it matches to all the other goodness in the thread