1972 Chevy 4wd Longhorn Project: Never Ending Changes

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by woodwright

Is there more seat pics? Hows the fit? I've got a 90 chevy seat in mine. I like the height, and the back is pretty slim so it has a little more leg room than a stock seat. It just seems a little narrow. The dodge ones are a little more comfortable, and I think they're wider.

I'd like to redo my mounts some time and lower the seat some. It sets a little higher than I'd like, but that is another day's project. I can try to find some other pics of it.

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by Mattman2010

No wonder the rear tires just spun when you where trying to put it on the trailer

No kidding right. It needs more aggressive tires.

[Mattman2010]

Yeah aggressive tires would probably help, but your ramps are heavily made and that is a lot of weight to get to bounce up on them.

[Dieselwrencher]

Here are some other pics of the seat.




Here are some of the mounts I made up.

[mosesburb]

Wow, I spend a couple weeks away from the computer and you go and finish this thing enough to drive it. Looks good. Maybe I should try the same trick with that other Ryan guy?? So, how does it ride with those small rear bags??

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by mosesburb

Wow, I spend a couple weeks away from the computer and you go and finish this thing enough to drive it. Looks good. Maybe I should try the same trick with that other Ryan guy?? So, how does it ride with those small rear bags??

It rides really nice considering what it is. It does burn outs smooth as silk too. It'll ride way sweet in another 6mo to a year. Haha

[6BT 56]

Hi Ryan truck is lookin super! Put some miles on the thing now ! Do you know how or where to measure the caster camber angle on a dana 60 ? Or what it should be ? Is caster camber even the rite term ? Im looking to increase the of angle of the steering axis of the steering kuckle . That make sence ? Move the lower king pin forward . My truck is kida jittery on the road and you are always paying attention when driving it or else ! Toe is at 0 and it has a new stabiliser . Still a 2 hander tho .

[ryanroo]

Originally Posted by 6BT 56

Hi Ryan truck is lookin super! Put some miles on the thing now ! Do you know how or where to measure the caster camber angle on a dana 60 ? Or what it should be ? Is caster camber even the rite term ? Im looking to increase the of angle of the steering axis of the steering kuckle . That make sence ? Move the lower king pin forward . My truck is kida jittery on the road and you are always paying attention when driving it or else ! Toe is at 0 and it has a new stabiliser . Still a 2 hander tho .

Caster and camber are two different alignment angles. camber is predetermined at the factory and is not adjustable.

caster is the angle of an imaginary line drawn through the center of the knuckle steering pivots compared to a line 90* from perfect level as viewed from the side. kingpin 60s seem to like 3-6* of positive caster(leaned towards the back of the vehicle at the top) so the line drawn through the steering pivots when looking at the drivers side is like this /

if it is wandering it probably needs a little more positive caster. and a smidge of toe in. measure the caster with the truck sitting as level as possible and loaded as it would be normally. then measure the angle of the top of the steering knuckle flat where the steering arm or spring cap is. you can usually get a close enough reading off the bolt heads for the spring cap, but using the top of the studs on the arm is sketch because they may not be threaded in the same amount.

[hgs_notes]

Truck looks great! I'll be down that way end of the month for the Iowa Gas show I think. And working in Iowa Falls. Might have to run down your way and get a better look.

[gerfunken]

Originally Posted by ryanroo

Caster and camber are two different alignment angles. camber is predetermined at the factory and is not adjustable.

caster is the angle of an imaginary line drawn through the center of the knuckle steering pivots compared to a line 90* from perfect level as viewed from the side. kingpin 60s seem to like 3-6* of positive caster(leaned towards the back of the vehicle at the top) so the line drawn through the steering pivots when looking at the drivers side is like this /

if it is wandering it probably needs a little more positive caster. and a smidge of toe in. measure the caster with the truck sitting as level as possible and loaded as it would be normally. then measure the angle of the top of the steering knuckle flat where the steering arm or spring cap is. you can usually get a close enough reading off the bolt heads for the spring cap, but using the top of the studs on the arm is sketch because they may not be threaded in the same amount.

Depending on the front end being used, there are some adjustments that may be able to be made on camber/caster. I remember that a number of fords used a bushing with the upper ball joint that allowed you to make some modifications. There are also some shims that you can use to help out for some of the GM components. But, as Ryan states, usually running about 1/16" toe-in will help with some of the wandering issues. You can also find some more information here:

Breaking it down:
Camber really helps with cornering.
Caster helps helps to recenter the wheels after a turn.
Toe-in helps with keeping the vehicle going straight down the road. (Conversely, toe-out really makes the vehicle drift/dart to the right/left as road surfaces change.)

For more information: LINK

[6BT 56]

Thanks guy's that just the info i needed . Now if it wernt so dam hot then i could actually actually get under it and fix that ! For now I'll just keep driving with 2 hands and dont dare reach for the coffe when road surfaces change . Lol.

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by hgs_notes

Truck looks great! I'll be down that way end of the month for the Iowa Gas show I think. And working in Iowa Falls. Might have to run down your way and get a better look.

Sounds good. Just PM me and I will get you my cell number. Is the gas show the Gas Pump show at the Holiday Inn on Fleur Drive in Des Moines?

Originally Posted by gerfunken

Depending on the front end being used, there are some adjustments that may be able to be made on camber/caster. I remember that a number of fords used a bushing with the upper ball joint that allowed you to make some modifications. There are also some shims that you can use to help out for some of the GM components. But, as Ryan states, usually running about 1/16" toe-in will help with some of the wandering issues. You can also find some more information here:

Breaking it down:
Camber really helps with cornering.
Caster helps helps to recenter the wheels after a turn.
Toe-in helps with keeping the vehicle going straight down the road. (Conversely, toe-out really makes the vehicle drift/dart to the right/left as road surfaces change.)

For more information: LINK

Those alignment bushings are only on ball joint applications. The only way to add camber in a kingpin axle is to bend it. But the problem with that is once you bend it, it weakens the housing.............

Originally Posted by 6BT 56

Thanks guy's that just the info i needed . Now if it wernt so dam hot then i could actually actually get under it and fix that ! For now I'll just keep driving with 2 hands and dont dare reach for the coffe when road surfaces change . Lol.

Most lift springs have a wedge bolted to it via the center pin and this will change the caster. Ryan is spot on on the 6*. I used to set big lifted trucks to 8 or 10* depending the terrain the truck would be driving on or how it drove. And on wider tires, 1/8" toe in helps.

[6BT 56]

Originally Posted by Dieselwrencher

Sounds good. Just PM me and I will get you my cell number. Is the gas show the Gas Pump show at the Holiday Inn on Fleur Drive in Des Moines?



Those alignment bushings are only on ball joint applications. The only way to add camber in a kingpin axle is to bend it. But the problem with that is once you bend it, it weakens the housing.............



Most lift springs have a wedge bolted to it via the center pin and this will change the caster. Ryan is spot on on the 6*. I used to set big lifted trucks to 8 or 10* depending the terrain the truck would be driving on or how it drove. And on wider tires, 1/8" toe in helps.

If i recall the dodge leaf springs sat higher in the front than the rear . the 56 springs are almost flat and mounted to a straight frame to boot . I bet when I bolted the D60 up I lost all my Caster . Thus shopping cart feeling .

[mjensen]

Well hot damn! That is awesome!

[hgs_notes]

Originally Posted by Dieselwrencher

Sounds good. Just PM me and I will get you my cell number. Is the gas show the Gas Pump show at the Holiday Inn on Fleur Drive in Des Moines?

That's the one.

http://iowagas.com/about/

Never been before, but looks like there will be a ton of cool gas/auto memorabilia to check out. I'm not a big collector, but I have a few things and looks like a fun swap meet. I think my uncle goes every year, he is a HUGE collector.

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by 6BT 56

If i recall the dodge leaf springs sat higher in the front than the rear . the 56 springs are almost flat and mounted to a straight frame to boot . I bet when I bolted the D60 up I lost all my Caster . Thus shopping cart feeling .

You need to go to a heavy truck shop and see what they can offer you for caster shims and go from there. I bet that is your biggest issue. Or, I've seen guys lower the front spring perches but this can lift the truck some, but it rolls the diff housing back giving you some caster. You have to do measuring before fimal welding though. If you had room, you could shorten the shackle bars instead. But I'm guessing shims are the best fix.

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by mjensen

Well hot damn! That is awesome!

Thanks.

Originally Posted by hgs_notes

That's the one.

http://iowagas.com/about/

Never been before, but looks like there will be a ton of cool gas/auto memorabilia to check out. I'm not a big collector, but I have a few things and looks like a fun swap meet. I think my uncle goes every year, he is a HUGE collector.

Well cool deal. I've always wanted to go check it out. Now you gave me a reason to.

[IwantaK5]

Awesome truck! I want to do something similar to my 72'. Did you box the frame rails? In the pics it didn't look like you did. I was wondering how necessary boxing the frame rails is for a 12v swap.

[ryanroo]

He had to box the rails. thats how all the cool kids were doing it and he wanted to fit in!

[IwantaK5]

But I don't want to fit in!!... I built my truck already using the factory equip. and i had the frame powder coated so i was hoping that the boxing was unnecessary, but i guess i would need to box. Thanks for the info.

[brimc]

Originally Posted by ryanroo

He had to box the rails. thats how all the cool kids were doing it and he wanted to fit in!

HAHAHA

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by IwantaK5

But I don't want to fit in!!... I built my truck already using the factory equip. and i had the frame powder coated so i was hoping that the boxing was unnecessary, but i guess i would need to box. Thanks for the info.

You don't have to box the frame if you keep the engine mild. I did it to "Fit in" and with all the other stuff I did I wanted the frame to be super strong for when the sled is back there. (If it ever is.)

[Dewey72]

Originally Posted by IwantaK5

Awesome truck! I want to do something similar to my 72'. Did you box the frame rails? In the pics it didn't look like you did. I was wondering how necessary boxing the frame rails is for a 12v swap.

I ended up plating the inside of my frame. Cut off the rivots and bolted in the plates. I wanted my frame to still twist a little.
Posted via Mobile Device

[watahyahknow]

the idea i had would use two frames
take both of the frames a part untill you left with the long pieces
cut about an inch off those lengthwize then use the leftside of one frame and weld it to the right side so you get a boxshape about the same width as the original frame
then i would prolly make some holes and wel in small pipes across the bolholes needed to be able to bolt anything to it
and make new crossmembers that will fit to the outside of that box

as long as the original frame goes straight back to front it could be done and it prolly keeps some of the original flex too

[ryanroo]

Originally Posted by watahyahknow

the idea i had would use two frames
take both of the frames a part untill you left with the long pieces
cut about an inch off those lengthwize then use the leftside of one frame and weld it to the right side so you get a boxshape about the same width as the original frame
then i would prolly make some holes and wel in small pipes across the bolholes needed to be able to bolt anything to it
and make new crossmembers that will fit to the outside of that box

as long as the original frame goes straight back to front it could be done and it prolly keeps some of the original flex too

that would add a lot of extra material where it is not needed in the flanges of the frame rail. not to mention there are features on the right frame rail that are not there on the left and visa versa. the rails wouldnt match up. it also provides a nice place for dust and moisture to live and start the rust monster in between the flangse of the rails. for the grand total of probably 100 bucks in material i was able to box mine in front to back 100%. there is still a token amount of frame flex as it is pretty much impossible to remove it totally, especially when there is the weight of a cummins on it. but, there is 0 benefit to frame flex, so having less is a good thing.

it isnt necessary of course. the frame will hold a cummins just fine. under 98% of average driving situations for a truck being used normally, i.e. street and pulling trailers/hauling loads, a stock frame in good shape will perform just fine.

i chose to box mine, and did my best to goad ryan into boxing his because as i said, no frame flex is the best. it leads to a better handling better riding and all around better performing vehicle in any situation. toss in the fact that i am going to be in the neighborhood of 500HP and hopefully more one day, and ryan will be able to make 800ish with the amount of air he can move, and those numbers are both going to be around 1000ft/lbs and more, that is a lot of twisting power for the frame to deal with... especially if it is strapped to a sled or a heavy trailer.