702 GMC V-12 powered '62 GMC 1-ton

[cayoterun]

Thanks, 89 Crew. I had looked at these sources before, but always looking for additional interchanges that might fit.
Since you're in Kansas, you can savvy my farmerized, make-it-work mentality, mainly because of short supply and distance to parts sources.
Thanks,
Cayoterun

[cayoterun]

Bigger toys need bigger tools.
Always needed a front end loader around here, but never did get one. I didn't have any way to handle the V-12, change truck cabs, and stuff like that safely, so found this old fella at a fair price. It's a Case 530 industrial, age unknown, probably back from early 60s. It's worn out, but everything works. Good enough for me.

If any one decides to mess with a V-12, you'll sure need something this big, (bigger wouldn't hurt), to lift it with. The pic with a motor hanging was first trial. Rear wheels were about off the floor. Will need more weight on the rear to move around much, then there's still risk of breaking a front axle or something.
My 2,000# cherry picker wouldn't even budge the motor, except one end.
Cayoterun

[89 crew]

If you want to learn more about your tractor look at this.
http://www.tractordata.com/td/td479.html

[cayoterun]

Thanks, Crew! This old tractor will need lots of easy use and TLC. I think I'll name it "Puddles". Price of hydraulic fluid, It will probably get all the seals I can find tho. $10 a gallon here. Ouch! Glad I quit and rented out.
I have an 830 Case-o-matic wheatland my uncle bought new in '66/w 5400 actual hrs on it. Never been touched except a valve job in late '70s.

The people on this site are great.
Thanks, again
Cayoterun

[ed2552]

Our tractor would handle that with ease, it is an International 1066 Hydro with a loader with interchangeable pallet forks and loader, best purchase my dad made last year, everything works, awesome, A/c is ICE cold and it is my favorite tractor to use. We bought it from our neighbor who retired last year

[cayoterun]

Wanna' trade? Just joking. What's a 1066 hp rating? 100hp or so? I stacked hay with one a neighbor had. It wasn't a hydro tho. nice tractors.
Cayoterun

[ed2552]

Yeah, i think about 100-120, we also have a 1486, that is about 160HP i think. The shipping would be a NIGHTMARE for it, but it is possible, but we will NEVER trade that tractor away

[ed2552]

The Hydro is awesome, it is like a hydrostatic lawnmower, forward to go forward, back to reverse, the farther the faster, depending on throttle. It is nice for hay, when you hit a thick spot you keep the motor up and can still slow down, and not have to shift

[89 crew]

here's the info for the 1066
Drawbar (rated): 108 hp [80.5 kW]
Drawbar (max): 105.95 hp [79.0 kW]
PTO (max): 125.7 hp [93.7 kW]
PTO (rated): 126 hp [94.0 kW]
11,861 lbs

the 1486
Drawbar (rated): 126 hp [94.0 kW]
PTO (rated): 146 hp [108.9 kW]
12,500 lbs

[cayoterun]

My favorite tractor for our custom round bale business, ever, was '74 4230 JD power shift. They are 100hp tractors. We had 2 just alike. They sure made a good team. I've kicked myself for not keeping one and putting a front end loader on it.
Cayoterun

[ed2552]

I thought the 1486 had more power, oh well, it is plenty strong as it is

[89 crew]

Those numbers do need a little translation.
the rated is what the manufacturer said it would do. the max numbers are from Nebraska testing.

[ed2552]

Yeah, but if the screw is cranked, it is more like 140, LOL

[89 crew]

well for Nebraska testing the manufacturer sends their engineers with the tractor to turn the screws for each test.

[cayoterun]

http://www.youtube.com/haystack155

We stuck another video on today. The camera batteries quit on this try, but will try to get part 2 running max rpm later today.
The stacks don't look right to me there in the stand, but pretty good sound, too loud to sound real good unless your some distance from it. We didn't have it warmed up enough and should have closed shop doors to get fire to show out the pipes when slowed down real quick.

If I can find an old car body/w good title and old enough to have the big fenders, it's tempting to use it instead of the truck path we following now. Then use 3/4 ton rear end/w single wheels. I have no intentions of making a good looking vehicle out of this, just something for showing the motor running under it's own power.
Will probably use the 5sp direct tranny for now, and start trying to mount it in the truck frame. Wish some of you young guys/w good eyes were here to do the cutting and welding on it for me.
Cayoterun

[cayoterun]

I've been asked several times how these stationary engines were cooled without a radiator, so here goes.
Pic#1: Well site/w Minneapolis-Moline engine, pump gear head, base, (water well under pump base) and engine cooling coil.
Pic#2: Engine cooling coil. Inside is a series of horizontal pipes connected together/w one inlet and outlet connected to the engine coolant lines running to motor. As the cold water is pumped out of well, it flows over the internal coolant pipes and out the other end into a underground distribution line. The fresh water is 5? degrees as it come out of the ground. The coolant is cooled with cool water as it circulates thru the internal pipes and back to engine in stead of cool air in a open radiator.

The barrel/w oil line supplies oil to the pump shaft that spins the pump@ 1750rpm around 300-400 feet below the surface. I'm guessing this has a 1.1 gear head, so motor is turning 1750rpm also.

Pic#3: Coolant lines from engine to cooling coil and back. The exposed pot lower right is the natural gas inlet for engine coming from a natural gas source about a mile away.
Pic#4: Rotating sprinkler. This one is 1/2 mile long and irrigates about 500 acres in one revolution.
Hope this is helpful to those who have asked.
Thanks,
Cayoterun

[jeffspower]

I love listening to the old MM's churning out power. Back home there's a guy that pulls a GVI. I suspect he is running power unit goodies in it- it really runs. It's cool to see something with a carburetor outpulling & running much faster ground speed than the diesels.

[cayoterun]

Jeff: Molines don't run, we say they chuckle at big loads. They run slower and have more power than the V-12s.

Ok--- Now I need lots of help and answers to many questions. We're ready to start trying to get it mounted in the frame. Still lots of frame cleaning, but maybe you guys can be thinking on the engineering.

I did decide to use that '72 Ford one ton frame. I don't like the twin I-beam but it had other things that might help us do this. The front of the frame rails fork out wider than the chevy and will accomodate a larger and wider radiator, they then narrow down under the cab no wider than the chevy.

Questions:
#1 Can a all drum brake master cylinder/w no power be used with disc fronts by putting a T in the line at the cylinder into both front and rear lines and still have adequate braking? Or do you need to use a master cylinder/w the two line outlet? Also, would a single fluid outlet master cylinder/w power booster be enough?

#2 Motor/tranny mounts:

As long and heavy as these are, would two motor mounts be enough or do we need Front and rear motor mounts/w a rear tranny mount for more support? As said prior, we're dealing with a combined weight over 2,000# and 7 1/2 feet long.

This thread is getting really long, so, Mods, if this needs to be moved or I need to reduce my posts, let me know, as I don't want to abuse web-site priveleges in any way. I'm new at this stuff, (computors), so don't know all the do's and don'ts.
Thanks,
Cayoterun

[89 crew]

For the brakes take a hyrdovac from a 40-70 series truck and put on. It will be powered by the single non power master cylender and then it will give you power brakes. All you will have to do is watch the size of the fluid bore in the hydrovac. If it is too big your breaks will be sensitive!

For the mounts I would look at how the engine was originally mounted. If it worked back then it will work today.

[cayoterun]

Crew: Is the hydrovac you refer to the ones like on the grain trucks and bigger that mounts of the frame? If so, will the later ones have one inlet from the master, and two outlets to front and back brakes, or would I have to tee them together.
Thats a good idea on this thing, as it would give more room on the firewall.
Motor Mounts: I know a guy who has a V-12 truck e-mail pics of his mounts. It's a tilt cab and easy to see.
Thanks for getting me to think "outside-the-box".
Cayoterun

[89 crew]

Yep, The ones that mount on the grain truck frame is what I'm thinking about. I have an old Champion motorhome with 2 of these boosters on it, and a ford F600 and F800 with them. I don't know what all is available for them fas as duel outputs, but I figured it was worth a look. If you do have to tee them together, oh well, it worked on the big trucks for years that way. You do have to put a one way valve on the vac line going to the hydrovac. If you get the proper valve there is a port on it to hook a vac gauge for the engine. That valve does have to be mounted higher than the engine. otherwise it is possible to get fluid to run down and stop the booster from working. Also keep an extra one of those plastic valves in the truck. I have seen a bunch of them split where they were melted together.

[cayoterun]

Thanks, I got a bunch of old trucks around to check out. Never occurred to me to go that route. Just proves a bunch of heads are better than one.
Cayoterun

[Bob B.]

Are you going to try to mount a 702 in a Ford F-250 chassis?

[cayoterun]

Ford F-350 1ton frame and running gear only. If I follow present plan, When I get motor, tranny, & driveline set in, then set a '62 GMC cab and extended front clip on it/w a steel flatbed.

The plan and ideas change from day to day.
I'm open to any and all ideas. Progress is sloow.
I picked up a junked V-12 stripped block today to use when building motor mounts and spacings. Don't have to worry about skinning up the running motor, plus much less weight to handle.
Cayoterun

[cayoterun]

Progress by leaps and bounds, (or maybe bumps and jerks). Looks like it's might to be easier than expected for the mounts. Maybe just need one different cross-member for tranny, but the others will need modified.

Dumb question: Rubber mounts are necessary for frame flex, and vibration dampening, Right?
Hope all of you say, no. It would be easy to mount the motor solid like in stands, but those two items weren't an issue stationary.
Frame length looks good and can leave plenty of room in front of the cab for motor access.

Would there be any down side to useing a small pto shaft/w a slide, and two small u-joints for the steering shaft? Any safety issues to consider? Looks like it would be as safe as those tire looking deals.

The original front cab mount is still on the frame between 3rd & 4th cylinders for comparision on length.

Thanks
Cayoterun