Tie rod installation for 85 question

[Wincks2]

A local garage said my outer tie rod ends need replacing to pass a provincial safety inspection. My understanding is that they need replacing because they move too much in the steering knuckles.

So I am attempting my first tie rod change.

To show what I'm asking about I've posted a video of me rotating the tie rod adjusting sleeve clamp causing the tie rod to move in the steering knuckle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCNWhtsBd_g

The manual has left me with these questions:

1. The inner tie rod seems to be moving as much in relation to the relay rod as the outer tie rod is to the steering knuckle. Does that mean the inner tie rod need replacing too?

2. The shop manual regarding installation reads, "Rotate both inner and outer tie rod housing rearward to the limit of ball joint travel before tightening clamps". Does "rearward" mean I move the top toward the rear or does it mean I move the bottom toward the rear?

3. The shop manual regarding installation reads, "Check each assembly to be sure that a total travel of at least 35 degrees can be obtained using a bubble protractor and a pair of vise grips". If the manual means grabbing the sleeve clamp with the vice grips and getting everything to move at least 35 degrees, I don't understand because I thought the reason to replace them is that they move too much now.

4. The work described in the manual is to be done with the wheels off of the ground. If replacing the outer tie rods will stop the existing movement, then does the 35 degree reference to an "assembly" refer to more than the tie rods and sleeve clamp. Does it refer to everything, including the entire steering knuckle and at the other end the relay rod moving as one unit and all moving more than 35 degrees simultaneously? The steering knuckle and relay rod are not moving now with tires still on the ground. Is it different when I jack it up?

[Wincks2]

A diagram at page 3B6-9 of the official manual and page 318 of a Haynes manual shows that "rearward rotation" means moving the bottom toward the rear.

So, question 2 is answered.

Still not sure what is to be rotated rearward. It reads, "Rotate both inner and outer tie rod housing rearward to the limit of ball joint travel before tightening clamps."

Do you think the housing means:

a. the outer tie rod end alone;

b. the sleeve clamp alone;

c. the outer tie rod end and the sleeve clamp;

d. the inner tie rod end and the sleeve clamp and the outer tie rod end?

Don't know how it could be d. because with the sleeve clamp not yet tightened wouldn't the tie rod ends rotate independently of the sleeve clamp? Don't know how it could be c. because if the outer and clamp move as one, why wouldn't the inner move with them?

[N2TRUX]

...

Originally Posted by Wincks2

A local garage said my outer tie rod ends need replacing to pass a provincial safety inspection......
The manual has left me with these questions:

1. The inner tie rod seems to be moving as much in relation to the relay rod as the outer tie rod is to the steering knuckle. Does that mean the inner tie rod need replacing too?

With out looking at them, it's hard to say. I prefer to replace suspension components in pairs. If one end is worn out, we can assume that the other end isn't far behind it.

2. The shop manual regarding installation reads, "Rotate both inner and outer tie rod housing rearward to the limit of ball joint travel before tightening clamps". Does "rearward" mean I move the top toward the rear or does it mean I move the bottom toward the rear?

I'm not sure why it says this but I would just center everything then tighten it down. Did you measure the length of the tierods before you removed the old ends? If not, your going to need your alignmemt checked anyway. If there is a need to adjust them tierods, the alignmemnt shop will do so.

[Wincks2]

Elsewhere in the official manual is, "As a guide to correct orientation of the inner tie rod end relative to the outer tie rod end, rotate both ends to the extremes of travel in the same direction before clamping."

If they were both clamped to the sleeve, rotating one would move the other. So it looks like the answer is A.

Then it refers to returning the rod assembly to midposition of its travel. Seems to me that when released after being clamped, it would naturally rotate all the way to some point. So don't know how to get it to stay at midposition. But I guess I will just give it a try to see what happens.

[Wincks2]

Thanks N2TRUX

Yes, I had watched some youtube videos suggesting counting threads, measuring, or adding some paint on the join to keep my place. So I have put some paint on all the connecting places so I can't confuse myself or lose count.

[Wincks2]

Maybe the looseness that requires a new tie rod is a looseness in wiggling a tire from front to back and maybe that is different than the ability to rotate the tie rods rearward and forward at least 35 degrees.

[N2TRUX]

Think of your tie rod ends as a ball and socket. The ball is supposed to rotate in the socket to all articulation in the linkage. If the ball becomes worn is is allowes "play" in the linkage. To much play and your suspension components are allowed to work independently rather than in unison. In an extremely worn condition, the tie rod ends could separate or shear off.

[Wincks2]

Great, N2TRUX, thanks!

So the 35 degrees is the rotation within the socket.

And the wiggle is the play and that must be what they want eliminated via replacing the tie rods.

As I have the same movement in both outer and inner joints, and that movement seems more wiggly or sudden movement across an open space than smooth rotation within a socket, and reading your suggestion above, I'm going to replace outer, inner, and the sleeves.

Thanks again for your help.