Familiar with LS Swaps? Come on in.

[Firebirdjones]

Hello to all. I'm new to the board. Hope we have a friendly bunch here.

I have a 72 Blazer and I'm gearing up for an LQ4/4L80E swap. I'm sure this has been done before so I'll start with 3 questions that are probably easiest for those that have done this swap and are the first obsticals I'll encounter. Then go from there.

1. Who makes or where do I find motor mounts for this swap?

2. Who makes long tube headers for this swap?

3. How is the 4L80E adapted to the transfer case?

On the third question, I believe the Blazer has an NP205 case originally (I could be wrong) but it is the original case in the truck. I've adapted a 4L60E to a Dana 300 case in a jeep before,,,someone made an adaptor for that but the name of the company escapes me.

I've got the harness and computer taken care of through Howell Engine Mangagment. I've used them before doing an LT1/4L60E swap in my wifes jeep. Harness is custom made and plug and play. So I'm going to use them again.

I may have other questions on fuel system and such as this progresses. I am not sure if an 02-03 LQ4 uses a returnless style system or not, but I'll get more in depth on that later. Thanks, Larry.

[jmuck]

Street & Performance has the motor mounts and the headers you need.
Advance Adapters makes the adapters for the tranny & transfer case.

[Firebirdjones]

Thank you sir. I'll check both of those places.

[Firebirdjones]

Well, Advance Adapters has the transfer case handled.

I guess my problem is with Street and Performance. There website search stinks, and I couldn't find motor mounts in there online catalog.

I didn't like what headers I saw in the catalog, all were shorties or mid length. I may as well stick with stock manifolds so I'll scratch that off the list. I did see some things that would solve the fuel supply issues.

I have some other issues to work out. It seems you can't change a drive-by-wire over to cable.
Anyone using a drive-by-wire gas pedal assembly for this swap???

[aggie91]

Here is another source. I know it is for 73-87 trucks, but the front frame is nearly identical to the 72 you have....

Check it out...
http://www.brphotrods.com/1955-1987%...y%20truck.html

[Firebirdjones]

Cool, thanks for the link. I'll check it out.

[SONOSADSACK]

FBJ,
How’s this swap going for you? Give up yet? Did you ever find real answers to your original three questions? I am attempting to do this swap as well and finding the more I dig the more questions I need to ask. There is plenty of info on this site for 2x’s. Probably to the point a guy could do a little reading, make a few phone calls, spend a couple of bucks and wait for the brown truck. I have yet to find a supplier for motor mounts or headers for the 4x swap. That I just don’t understand. As far as the trans to t-case adapter goes, boy howdy was I naïve. I asked a very simple question…. “Can I mate a 4l80e to an np205?” Almost everyone that I asked agreed with almost the same response “All you will need is the conversion kit from advance adapters.” They were right, you can. Here’s where my real learning started. If you ask a very simple question, you will probably get a very simple answer. The kit that everyone was referring to and the one I almost bought for six hundred and some odd dollars includes a new adapter an input gear to convert a 27 spline np205 to a 32 spline along with some other odds and ends. So, as I’m reading through the manual I start thinking, if this kit is converting a 27 spline case to a 32 spline case, why wouldn’t I just start with a 32 spline case? Back on the phone again with AA. This time I learn that if you start with a 32 spline case you can get away with simply purchasing the adapter for two hundred and some change that is included in the kit although you wont find it listed anywhere on their website. Now I’m not the sharpest knife in the drawer but this is getting cheaper, right? Ok, so I do a little horse trading and get myself a 32 spline case. A few days later and I’m ready to purchase the adapter. Call AA again (same tech) refresh his memory as to who the idiot on the other end of the line is and the first question he asks is “what year is that case?” As soon as he asked me I knew what I had done. My new case is from an 86 or newer one ton. Round six bolt pattern not race track. The tech then tells the bad news is their adapter won’t work! The good news is with a small amount a machining the case and the tranny will bolt together using the th400 adapter. He has nothing to sell me. Then he says if you had a 4l80e out of a 4x rather than out of a car you wouldn’t even have to swap the out put shaft, just add a reluctor ring to the existing shaft. Now I haven’t actually been able to mount the two together yet as the th400 adapter hasn’t come home from the machine shop yet and my tranny will get dropped of this weekend. Maybe in a week or so I’ll know. Next step will be mounting and somehow I imaging I’ll be learning more about these two units before they are in my Blazer doing what I would like them to do. Anyway, enough of my little story. I have learned quite a bit about our trucks from this site and just wanted to share some of my learning for once.
1) Don’t rely on someone else to ask the “right” questions. It might cost you.
2) If you ever find a knowledgeable tech, never let him hang up without getting his direct number!!

[Firebirdjones]

Cool, sounds like you are moving right along.

I had found out about the spline ordeal. I would rather convert my existing 205. My truck only has 70K miles, the T-case is leak free and doesn't make any funny noises. The last thing I want is starting with another case that might have other issues, know what I mean???

I passed on headers. All I could find were shorties for this application, which don't interest me in the least bit. It's long tubes or nothing for me. So I'm just sticking to the manifolds. Truck currently has long tubes on it,,,so I'll just fab up some down pipes to connect everything and call it done. If long tube headers become available in the future, it's an easy swap later down the road.

I was able to find motor mounts from another supplier called Earlyclassic.com

Other than moving the engine forward, I don't forsee any other problems yet. Just doing alot of research to be as prepared as possible. So I'm interested in hearing your progress.
Right now I am just collecting all these parts and they are laying around waiting for me
Actually it's our daily driver, and I don't plan to tear it apart until my son is out of school in a few months. Then the fun begins. I don't want to start it until I know I can stay on it until it's finished

Please keep me posted on your progress..

[tallhoedude]

ive done an ls swap,helped with a cpl more.
any help i can give,just ask,send me a pm.

ck with diy4x.com he may be able to help w engine mounts.
also some pics of stuff i did on mine in my build thread.

[SONOSADSACK]

Tallhoedude,
I just read your build, again. Very impressive!! One of your pictures show a little bit of your motor mounts. Are they custom built or off the shelf? What about pan clearance? Thanks for the info on diy4x.com. According to their site they have improved their kit but they don’t give any details. Guess I’ll be giving them a call.

[tallhoedude]

thanks.
i would def call them and see.
i had the diy kit,but as i got into my build i wanted to
set the motor 4" fwd and 4" lower into the frame to help
better keep as long a driveline as possible and as low a center of gravity as possible.the kit was very nice,and what i ended up using,just cut the crossmember up,modified the mounts for what i needed,pan clearance should not be an issue running in stock location.

also ck out ls1tech.com there are several ls builds on 67-72 trucks

[Thealien]

Kert is working on my LS/first gen crossmember motor mount as we speak. Here is a thread showing how the original would not fit,


HERE IS THAT THREAD

Kert has been very patient with me and in that thread you can see the template I made and sent to him. I even taped cardboard cutouts to the template so he could see how close the engine and the block protrusions were in relation to that template. My Jimmy is at stock height and that is where it gets tricky. There is very little room for the crossmember/front differential. Even with the crossmember that Kert makes me I may need to lift the truck 2-4 inches which I do not want to do.

When I get the crossmember I will take a bunch of measurements and post lots of pics. I am going to move the crossmmber as far back on the engine as possible, drilling new holes in the adapter plats if necessary. I may even have to move where the crossmember bolts to the frame rearward a little?

If you have a lifted 4X4 there are pictures of Pacific Fabrications crossmember/motor mount in the link in my signature. It is fairly reasonable and isalready done for you.

The way I am having Kert do mine I am having him not weld the crossmember to the plates that bolt to the frame mounts. I feel this will give me more flexability with engine placement forward and back and up and down (I want to use a flex fan and keep the fan centered in the shroud if possible). When I get everything where I want it I will tack weld a few spots and have a better welder than me add in the gussets and finish welding. That is if I can even make it work?

[Firebirdjones]

Very interesting Thealien.
I've been contemplating this very issue with mine. There is no way I'm lifting our blazer at all.
So making this work is a necessity for me. I am also against moving the transfer case "at all" so the engine will have to move forward as much as necessary.
Have you kept the T-case in the stock location?? Maybe you mentioned it and I missed it.

In my opinion the engine could stand to be moved forward anyway in these 4x4 blazers.

[Thealien]

I am waiting for my transfer case to be assembled as we speak.


Here is my thread when I got the TC from the powder coater.

I am keeping the transfer case in the stock location for a couple of reasons

1- My driveshafts are fairly new and I didn't want the expense of altering or new.

2-My floor has a liner (kind of like als liner) and I didn't want to have to cut the floor for shifter relocation.

When I get the transfer case back I will install it in the stock location and then install my transmission with adapters next. There is some information on what is involved in mating a 4L60 to my NP205 in the link in my signature. After the transmission we will see where the engine sits. Regardless ofthe engine location (4X4s put the engine rearward due to differntial and 2WD put the engine about where ine will sit about 2" forward) I want to get my motor mounts and crossmember as far rearward as I can for as much front differntial clearance as I can. I have found no other information on a stock height 4X4 LS swap so it looks like have to learn as much as I can on my own. As you can see in my LS swap thread I have done tons of research.

Did I read somewhere that you want to go with a 4L80? The 4L80 is about 2 1/4-2 1/2 inches longer than the 4L60 with adapter. I am not sure there is room to move the engine forward more than the 2 inches without serious differntial interferance issues?


Here is a site with transmission measurements. The B measurement is what we need to be concerned with

With all that being said I am not 100% sure it can be done without a lift. But I will do my best.

[Firebirdjones]

Yes I've got the 4L80E which is longer. That's where my dilema is.
I'm not moving the transfer case for the same reasons you describe, I'm not cutting the floor to relocate the shifter, and I'm not messing with new driveshafts either.
So if it comes down to it and I can't make it work, I will swap to the 4L60E which means a new adapter setup unfortunately. I don't mind moving the engine as far forward as I have to, as long as there is oil pan clearance.

[Thealien]

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Yes I've got the 4L80E which is longer. That's where my dilema is.
I'm not moving the transfer case for the same reasons you describe, I'm not cutting the floor to relocate the shifter, and I'm not messing with new driveshafts either.
So if it comes down to it and I can't make it work, I will swap to the 4L60E which means a new adapter setup unfortunately. I don't mind moving the engine as far forward as I have to, as long as there is oil pan clearance.

Its not really the oil pan. It is the locationof the motor mounts and crossmember. If you look at my crossmember pics linked a few posts ago you will see the DIY4X4 crossmember is very close to the differntial in the 4X4 location (stock). The LS engine is a little wider/deeper making it even worse. The one advantage we have is with the adapter plates we can kind of move things around to anywhere on the plates as long as we clear the oil pan and I think even all the way back on the plates would clear the pan. If I ever get my crossmember I'll post some pics so we all can see?

Personally I can't see how you could use a 4L80 without moving the transfer case back as much as you move the engine forward? You "might" be able to modify the shifter so you don't have to cut the floor but you would still have to alter/make driveshafts.

I very well could be wrong and I hope someone comes along and shows how to do it. I will be happy to include it in my swap thread for others to use.

[Thealien]

All I can say is have a little patience and in 4-6 weeks I should have lots more information with pics etc. Should answer a lot of the what iffs?

[Firebirdjones]

Originally Posted by Thealien

Its not really the oil pan. It is the locationof the motor mounts and crossmember. If you look at my crossmember pics linked a few posts ago you will see the DIY4X4 crossmember is very close to the differntial in the 4X4 location (stock). The LS engine is a little wider/deeper making it even worse. The one advantage we have is with the adapter plates we can kind of move things around to anywhere on the plates as long as we clear the oil pan and I think even all the way back on the plates would clear the pan. If I ever get my crossmember I'll post some pics so we all can see?

Personally I can't see how you could use a 4L80 without moving the transfer case back as much as you move the engine forward? You "might" be able to modify the shifter so you don't have to cut the floor but you would still have to alter/make driveshafts.

I very well could be wrong and I hope someone comes along and shows how to do it. I will be happy to include it in my swap thread for others to use.

I'm going to give it a shot before I resort to a 4L60E. I'm not that much of a fan of the 700's (or 4L60,,same thing) I don't like the 3.06 first gear and the huge rpm drop to second. I can live with it though.

My biggest complaint with them is I've broken a couple of them, so I won't use one unless I go through it with a Beast sun shell and a few other upgrades. That's just going to add to the cost of the swap for me.

[Thealien]

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

I'm going to give it a shot before I resort to a 4L60E. I'm not that much of a fan of the 700's (or 4L60,,same thing) I don't like the 3.06 first gear and the huge rpm drop to second. I can live with it though.

My biggest complaint with them is I've broken a couple of them, so I won't use one unless I go through it with a Beast sun shell and a few other upgrades. That's just going to add to the cost of the swap for me.

You have to change the output shaft to mate it to an NP205. While I was in there I did all that. The shaft was more money than the sun shell and clutches.

[Critter]

Any progress with the drivetrain? I had my heart set on a 4L65e but now I am leaning towards MAKING the 4L80e work. Too many variables!!!

[chevydog66]

Subscribing, LQ4 on the way for me and my 72GMC 2wd.