Who would want a crossmember to lay out on 20's

[fastbagged68]

Who would want a complete crossmember that would lay out on 20's with out a crossmember drop? What would you be willing to pay for it? The crossmember would come with tubular lower control arms and the upper would be reworked with the correct ball joint angles. Also would be setup with bags. All you would need to do is bolt your disc brakes up and bolt the crossmember up to the stock location and plug your air lines in. Any input would be great. Thanks

[lost wages]

id be interested but what about clearance between the fender and the tire? ive already cut the hood hinge and fender and my tire hits the edge of the fender now?

[SCOTI]

If the price wasn't outrageous (subjective), & it bolted in place of stock stuff, there would be interest. Tell us more about the a-arms & what compromises buyers would have if using.

[PrimeredThunder]

Would there have to be any changes to the steering box/shaft? Sounds intresting, any pictures?

[SledBurban]

would you be able to purchase the items seperately...some of us wont need everything but the crossmember and lca's would be nice.....

[fastbagged68]

Well.... the way I would sell it would be all bolt in. Stock location. A little in sight for you guys that are having hood hinge problems and cutting your fenders..... when you slam these trucks the tire sit more towards the back of the wheelwell. If you want you can weld up your holes in the frame and move the crossmember forward however much you want to make it look right in your wheel well.
I would like to sell at least the crossmember and lower arms. I will post pics in a few weeks of what it will basically look like and do.
The steering issues will only be putting a few borgenson joints on the column, fairly easy. Most likely these will come raw, no paint. Let me know what a reasonable price would be for something like this. My partner and I are throwing this idea around with the one we are doing now.

[1972C10]

If it had some adjustable coilovers Maybe.

[SCOTI]

This sounds interesting.... keep us updated.

[GMCGRANDS]

Fastbagged,

[GMCGRANDS]

Fastbagged,
I would be interested in seeing what you have. I have been working on front suspension variations for a while. I started with stock crossmember and ECE dropped spindles, coils and fast ratio gear. Stage two I went to Turners crossmember, power rack, and tubular A-arms. I now have a fabricated bolt on crossmember tubular A-arms top and bottom that use the truck ball joints and spindles. Using the T-bird rack. I have been trying to get the geometry worked out , and the postion to look right in the wheel wells. Its been alot of hassle. I have been hunting for informaton on how to minimize bump steer, and getting the corect distance and angles for the a arms. I currently have a 2 degree rake on the upper arms. I have it set-up for coil springs at the moment but it would be easy to use bags or coil overs as well. With dropped spindles it will sit extremely low. I want to sit low but have much better handling. I currently have mounted the stock spindles back on because I felt it was to low. This has drove me crazy over the last year I wish I had bought a off the self kit (Jimmy Meyer racing, flat-out eng., or progresive). I have enough suspension componets to build three front ends and I am still not satisfied. I can e-mail someone some high resolution pictures if there is someone who can resize and post them. Let me know a email address.

Mark

[Captkaos]

Mark, send them to webmaster@73-87chevytrucks.com and I will resize them for you.

[GMCGRANDS]

You have mail.

Thanks for help. Im on dial-up it stinks.

[Captkaos]

Here are you pics Mark.

[Captkaos]

Since you are basing this on a stock or dropped spindle, it would probably be easier to use the stock lengths of the upper and lower control arms. Of course that would mean you would have to verify the positioning of their mounting points and it would be limited by your set track width.

How much bumpsteer are you getting now? You would have to measure with the steering arms connected. Is it under or over (toe-in or toe-out)? You really want toe-out? From what I have read, .010 - .020" per inch of travel is a good amount.

[GMCGRANDS]

Captkaos, Track width is the same as stock. mounting points of a-arms are different due to different heights than stock. Lower a-arms length is different. One of the big hurdles is adapting the rack to the spindles. Truck spindle taper is largest at the top. Most kits you see the taper is largest at the bottom. I dont like the angle of the tie rods if you mount in top. If the taper was opposite the tierods would be near flat in relation to the lower a-arm. If you move the rack up Im concerned about bump steer. What do you know about measureing bump steer. Im not real clear but have heard of several companies that change the hinge point of the threaded rods were they mount to the rack. I do understand you want the tie rods to swing in the closest possible arc in relation to the a-arms. I have been looking for some good suspension information but yet to find a good source.

Didnt mean to Hi-jack Fastbaggeds thread. I think there are a number of us on the board that are fed up with Bill Turner and have resorted to trying to come up with a new approach. Captkaos your crossmember is the best approach ive seen using the factory stuff.

[Captkaos]

A way to measure bumpsteer fairly accurate is to set the chassis at frame height and place a board or plywood at the wheel face. It should touch both the top AND bottom of the tire. With a jack under the tire, move the suspension up to full travel making sure the board stays in place at the bottom. Looking down on the tire you should be able to tell if it toes in or out by noticing how far the front and rear of the tire is from the board.

Moving the rack up in relation to where you have it now should reduce the amount of bumpsteer because it is moving it closer to the centerline of the wheel and therefore less angle is affected. Generally you want bump to toe-out as it is more predictable.

There is a TON of other variables that go into suspension design though, and you really don't want to be guessing on where you want components placed.

One of the best suspension books I have read is Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams

[camaro__thunder]

What SCOTI said

[68LSS1]

Ditto on the Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams. Unfortunately the Pro-touring.com board just moved to a new style board and I don't think all the old threads are going to be carried over. They get into some excellent discussions on bumpsteeer, CG, sway bars, etc in the suspension section.

[fastbagged68]

I put the crossmember I have been working with in the truck. It will lay frame no problem with out the crossmember notch. I will get pics up in a week or so. Hopefully.

[XXL]

Originally Posted by GMCGRANDS

I think there are a number of us on the board that are fed up with Bill Turner and have resorted to trying to come up with a new approach. Captkaos your crossmember is the best approach ive seen using the factory stuff.

Are you planning to relocate your crossmember further forward?

[GMCGRANDS]

XXL, yes i want to move the spindle centerline forward.

Thanks Kaptkaos and 68LSS1 I will see if I can find the book.

[72c10step]

Originally Posted by Captkaos

One of the best suspension books I have read is Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams

Yes, that is a great Book! One of the best I've read as well. I got it off Amazon.com for around $13-14. A very good investment. If I remember correctly, he's also A Kettering/GMI alumnus!

[ZZ4Blazer]

Originally Posted by fastbagged68

I put the crossmember I have been working with in the truck. It will lay frame no problem with out the crossmember notch. I will get pics up in a week or so. Hopefully.

I want pics!!

[LONGHAIR]

I'm certainly not critisizing your work, it seems that you have put a lot into this. But the one comment that I would make is about the mounting of the upper control arm. That block seems to be a bit narrow for the A-arm itself. The mounting tubes are longer than the width of the block. I would think that this would give you some flex......especially with a tire that wide on such a heavy truck. It may be fine for drag racing, but you seem to be after handling. Any fore-aft movement of the upper balljoint (from braking or cornering) in relation to the lower will give you a funny feel, along with changing not only the caster but the toe as well.
I like the solid mount, with the adjustment in the arm itself, but I think wider upper mounting will help.