P.O.R. 15 info - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

James McClure · 01-06-2008, 06:19 AM

Morning all. I have seen a few references to POR 15 and see a few problems with how it's being used and how surfaces to be coated are being prepaired.
POR needs a "tooth". The surface does not need to be rusty enough for you to actually see the rust. Once steel is exposed to the air it starts rusting right away and thats all the rust POR needs to work as designed.
Prep is simple but a royal pain. Sandblast everything to be coated. It doesen't need to be right down to pure gray, dark spots are ok, BUT, make sure there is NO rust flake, they will peel off. Next spray the POR so you have an even thickness (brush on isn't the way to go here). At 65 to 70 degrees shoot the first coat, wait 2 hours and shoot it again and wait for it to tack to a point where it feels slightly sticky but doesen't color your fingertip when you touch it. Now shoot it with epoxy primer and wait for that to tack up and then paint it with a good acrilic enamel and let it cure for a day before getting into bolting stuff back on. POR is NOT UV protected and MUST be painted over to protect it from UV radiation. Follow the coating\painting procedure above. If you don't you'll have to scuff the surfaces you let dry to long to get paint to stick to the POR. POR is tough so scuffing is a chore. Been there done that, NO fun.
If I ever do another total restore I'm going to disassemble the frame and spray everything with S.E.M. bedliner material and see how that works. jim

Thumpin455 · 01-06-2008, 01:07 PM

I been using Eastwoods Rust Encapsulator. Much easier to work with, gotta wait and see how it does keeping the rust from coming back. I used it on the roof of a car that had a vinyl top, pitted rather badly. Also for fun shot the rust holes on the swb before I shot the primer and enamel. The swb is sitting outside for the winter enjoying the snow, so its sort of an acid test.

I dont know which one is better, or if one doesnt work. Just finding out the hard way, got nothing better to do really.

BaddBusa2005 · 01-06-2008, 01:51 PM

I have some pitting rust around my rear window. I am trying to figure out what I am going to do for it.

James McClure · 01-07-2008, 02:17 AM

Thumpin: Let us all know the results of your test. You and I live in the "salt" belt and have more trouble with rust than anyone else in the country. I'm restoring my 84 and POR'ed everything. At $48 a quart it had better work as stated. I also sprayed S.E.M. bedliner material over the whole bottom of the truck while it was off the chassis. The cab got a coat of fiberglass as well so that isn't going to rust. When it's done I'll post some pics. jim

James McClure · 01-07-2008, 02:28 AM

Badd: Made this reply in 2 parts. The rust pits you speak of around the back window, do they even touch the gasket\back window seal? If they do, take the back glass out, grind the flange and look for perforation. If it is perforated rebuild the flange with fiberglass. I know it isn't the easiest product to work with, but it you do it right you won't ever have to do it again. My rear glass was OK, the front is a different story. All along the lower windshield flange there were holes rusted through. I rebuilt the flange with glass and you can't tell the difference. The added thickness of a glass\steel sandwich holds the gasket better hopefully making a better seal. jim

Restrorob · 01-07-2008, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James McClure

The cab got a coat of fiberglass as well so that isn't going to rust.

Jim,

This may sound like a stupid question but, Did you put the glass on the bare sand blasted metal first with the Por over that or the Por first with the glass over ?

Reason I ask is you say the Por is hard to scuff once dry which glass requires a good scuff for good adhesion. Well, The glass is also hard to scuff once dry, so what was your method for scuffing for proper adhesion of either.

My cab floor is blasted and has a few scattered pin holes so my plan is to glass, I'm just not sure which to apply first. I also planned applying bed lining to the floor as well for added protection.

One last question; How many quarts of Por would it take to cover the whole bottom floor area of the cab ?

Thanks

James McClure · 01-08-2008, 06:54 AM

Rob: You can do the floor of the cab either way, glass first or POR. I POR'ed mine first then glassed it. If you let the POR get just tacky like I said in prevous post then prime it. The glass will stick to the primer just fine. If you glass first I would do both sides. A metal glass sandwich so to speak. I did the POR thing on both sides after I replaced the floor, primed it and then glassed the entire bottom of the cab and the outer sections of the floor inside. Then just to make sure no water and salt could get in I sprayed the bottom of the entire truck with bedliner material before putting the cab back on the chassis. You would NOT believe the ammount of money I have into this. Here's a hint. ALL the exteriour sheetmetal is genuine GM!! Paint is 2 coats of black epoxy, 2 coats of metalflake, 2 coats of clear, 1 coat of perl and 2 more coats of clear. All sanded between coats. Care to take a guess??Truck isn't done yet. I still have to paint and assemble the box. I have a bunch of pictures of what I have done, but in all truthfulness, none of them really do the truck justice, and besides that, I'm no photographer. Send an e-mail to jmcclur2@nycap.rr.com and I'll send ya some pics. I tried to post them here but can't seem to get it to work at all. Just for grins I think I'll start a new thread with all the specs and see who comes closest and really knows what goes in to a full restoration. LOL What do you think? I doubt anyone comes within 2 grand, but you never know. jim

James McClure · 01-08-2008, 07:24 AM

Rob: I never answered all your questions, sorry. It will take less then a quart to spray it with POR even if you coat it twice, but if you "glass sandwich" the whole thing, the POR won't be necessary, just prime the glass and paint it with a good epoxy overcoat and you'll be done with it. A little note here. The floor supports are "U" channel laid on it's side so there is a huge gap on the open side. I filled that open side with spray in insulation material and after it cured cut it back so it was flat then did the glass work. If you can, work in rather small sections and precut glass fabric for each section and fit it before you mix up the resin. I fitted each piece and held it in place with magnets on an upper edge then lifted it up then coated the metal and let the fabric back down into the resin and then coated it again until you can see through it (nothing white showing). I did the bottom like this. Right side just into the trans tunnel. then left side the same way, then the trans tunnel. I did the rear body mount bar at the same time and then went over it from side to side. You will have to overlap panels, so, overlap by at least 4". When you have the bottom all covered and the resin is cured give the lumps you will have a mild sanding. Try not to get into the cloth to much. Then mix up another batch of resin and coat the whole thing again. Working around the cab corners is the toughest part. Just be patient as you do the fitting and it will work out fine. Use anything you have to to keep the cloth in place. Magnets, clothes pins and whatever, because you will be putting unsupported fiberglass into the cab corner area after you cover it with glass. I used between 50 and 60 square feet of fabric and 7 quarts of resin, not to mention about a dozen cheapo paint brushes. Hope this helps some. If you want to discuss this in depth I'll be glad to talk to you. Put your phone number in your e-mail and I'll give you a call, just give me a time when to call. Don't worry about your number getting out, It won't. jim

01-06-2008, 06:19 AM	#1
James McClure One shot, one kill. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saratoga Springs NY Posts: 859	P.O.R. 15 info Morning all. I have seen a few references to POR 15 and see a few problems with how it's being used and how surfaces to be coated are being prepaired. POR needs a "tooth". The surface does not need to be rusty enough for you to actually see the rust. Once steel is exposed to the air it starts rusting right away and thats all the rust POR needs to work as designed. Prep is simple but a royal pain. Sandblast everything to be coated. It doesen't need to be right down to pure gray, dark spots are ok, BUT, make sure there is NO rust flake, they will peel off. Next spray the POR so you have an even thickness (brush on isn't the way to go here). At 65 to 70 degrees shoot the first coat, wait 2 hours and shoot it again and wait for it to tack to a point where it feels slightly sticky but doesen't color your fingertip when you touch it. Now shoot it with epoxy primer and wait for that to tack up and then paint it with a good acrilic enamel and let it cure for a day before getting into bolting stuff back on. POR is NOT UV protected and MUST be painted over to protect it from UV radiation. Follow the coating\painting procedure above. If you don't you'll have to scuff the surfaces you let dry to long to get paint to stick to the POR. POR is tough so scuffing is a chore. Been there done that, NO fun. If I ever do another total restore I'm going to disassemble the frame and spray everything with S.E.M. bedliner material and see how that works. jim __________________ 1984 K20 350M engine with 465,000 miles. Well, it's finally done!! Almost 2 years of work, but it was really worth the effort. Little stuff left to do is mount winch, wet sand & buff out and build belly pan\running boards. Body work takes lots and LOTS of beer!!!! God, Guts and Guns made America and God, Guts and Guns will preserve it! The worst thing you could do is get into my sights, but that don't matter, you'll never know it, cause you'll never hear the shotJim or Paladin whichever you choose.

01-06-2008, 01:07 PM	#2
Thumpin455 My truck is an alcoholic Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Marquette Mi Posts: 303	Re: P.O.R. 15 info I been using Eastwoods Rust Encapsulator. Much easier to work with, gotta wait and see how it does keeping the rust from coming back. I used it on the roof of a car that had a vinyl top, pitted rather badly. Also for fun shot the rust holes on the swb before I shot the primer and enamel. The swb is sitting outside for the winter enjoying the snow, so its sort of an acid test. I dont know which one is better, or if one doesnt work. Just finding out the hard way, got nothing better to do really. __________________ Too much stuff, too many projects to list everything. my 454 urged 76 swb beater

01-06-2008, 01:51 PM	#3
BaddBusa2005 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 440	Re: P.O.R. 15 info I have some pitting rust around my rear window. I am trying to figure out what I am going to do for it. __________________ 1981 Custom Deeluxe SWB 5.3/4L60e 3.73 and Auburn. Mustang Dyno 265hp/258tq

01-07-2008, 02:17 AM	#4
James McClure One shot, one kill. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saratoga Springs NY Posts: 859	Re: P.O.R. 15 info Thumpin: Let us all know the results of your test. You and I live in the "salt" belt and have more trouble with rust than anyone else in the country. I'm restoring my 84 and POR'ed everything. At $48 a quart it had better work as stated. I also sprayed S.E.M. bedliner material over the whole bottom of the truck while it was off the chassis. The cab got a coat of fiberglass as well so that isn't going to rust. When it's done I'll post some pics. jim __________________ 1984 K20 350M engine with 465,000 miles. Well, it's finally done!! Almost 2 years of work, but it was really worth the effort. Little stuff left to do is mount winch, wet sand & buff out and build belly pan\running boards. Body work takes lots and LOTS of beer!!!! God, Guts and Guns made America and God, Guts and Guns will preserve it! The worst thing you could do is get into my sights, but that don't matter, you'll never know it, cause you'll never hear the shotJim or Paladin whichever you choose.

01-07-2008, 02:28 AM	#5
James McClure One shot, one kill. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saratoga Springs NY Posts: 859	Re: P.O.R. 15 info Badd: Made this reply in 2 parts. The rust pits you speak of around the back window, do they even touch the gasket\back window seal? If they do, take the back glass out, grind the flange and look for perforation. If it is perforated rebuild the flange with fiberglass. I know it isn't the easiest product to work with, but it you do it right you won't ever have to do it again. My rear glass was OK, the front is a different story. All along the lower windshield flange there were holes rusted through. I rebuilt the flange with glass and you can't tell the difference. The added thickness of a glass\steel sandwich holds the gasket better hopefully making a better seal. jim __________________ 1984 K20 350M engine with 465,000 miles. Well, it's finally done!! Almost 2 years of work, but it was really worth the effort. Little stuff left to do is mount winch, wet sand & buff out and build belly pan\running boards. Body work takes lots and LOTS of beer!!!! God, Guts and Guns made America and God, Guts and Guns will preserve it! The worst thing you could do is get into my sights, but that don't matter, you'll never know it, cause you'll never hear the shotJim or Paladin whichever you choose.

01-08-2008, 06:54 AM	#7
James McClure One shot, one kill. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saratoga Springs NY Posts: 859	Re: P.O.R. 15 info Rob: You can do the floor of the cab either way, glass first or POR. I POR'ed mine first then glassed it. If you let the POR get just tacky like I said in prevous post then prime it. The glass will stick to the primer just fine. If you glass first I would do both sides. A metal glass sandwich so to speak. I did the POR thing on both sides after I replaced the floor, primed it and then glassed the entire bottom of the cab and the outer sections of the floor inside. Then just to make sure no water and salt could get in I sprayed the bottom of the entire truck with bedliner material before putting the cab back on the chassis. You would NOT believe the ammount of money I have into this. Here's a hint. ALL the exteriour sheetmetal is genuine GM!! Paint is 2 coats of black epoxy, 2 coats of metalflake, 2 coats of clear, 1 coat of perl and 2 more coats of clear. All sanded between coats. Care to take a guess??Truck isn't done yet. I still have to paint and assemble the box. I have a bunch of pictures of what I have done, but in all truthfulness, none of them really do the truck justice, and besides that, I'm no photographer. Send an e-mail to jmcclur2@nycap.rr.com and I'll send ya some pics. I tried to post them here but can't seem to get it to work at all. Just for grins I think I'll start a new thread with all the specs and see who comes closest and really knows what goes in to a full restoration. LOL What do you think? I doubt anyone comes within 2 grand, but you never know. jim __________________ 1984 K20 350M engine with 465,000 miles. Well, it's finally done!! Almost 2 years of work, but it was really worth the effort. Little stuff left to do is mount winch, wet sand & buff out and build belly pan\running boards. Body work takes lots and LOTS of beer!!!! God, Guts and Guns made America and God, Guts and Guns will preserve it! The worst thing you could do is get into my sights, but that don't matter, you'll never know it, cause you'll never hear the shotJim or Paladin whichever you choose.

01-08-2008, 07:24 AM	#8
James McClure One shot, one kill. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saratoga Springs NY Posts: 859	Re: P.O.R. 15 info Rob: I never answered all your questions, sorry. It will take less then a quart to spray it with POR even if you coat it twice, but if you "glass sandwich" the whole thing, the POR won't be necessary, just prime the glass and paint it with a good epoxy overcoat and you'll be done with it. A little note here. The floor supports are "U" channel laid on it's side so there is a huge gap on the open side. I filled that open side with spray in insulation material and after it cured cut it back so it was flat then did the glass work. If you can, work in rather small sections and precut glass fabric for each section and fit it before you mix up the resin. I fitted each piece and held it in place with magnets on an upper edge then lifted it up then coated the metal and let the fabric back down into the resin and then coated it again until you can see through it (nothing white showing). I did the bottom like this. Right side just into the trans tunnel. then left side the same way, then the trans tunnel. I did the rear body mount bar at the same time and then went over it from side to side. You will have to overlap panels, so, overlap by at least 4". When you have the bottom all covered and the resin is cured give the lumps you will have a mild sanding. Try not to get into the cloth to much. Then mix up another batch of resin and coat the whole thing again. Working around the cab corners is the toughest part. Just be patient as you do the fitting and it will work out fine. Use anything you have to to keep the cloth in place. Magnets, clothes pins and whatever, because you will be putting unsupported fiberglass into the cab corner area after you cover it with glass. I used between 50 and 60 square feet of fabric and 7 quarts of resin, not to mention about a dozen cheapo paint brushes. Hope this helps some. If you want to discuss this in depth I'll be glad to talk to you. Put your phone number in your e-mail and I'll give you a call, just give me a time when to call. Don't worry about your number getting out, It won't. jim __________________ 1984 K20 350M engine with 465,000 miles. Well, it's finally done!! Almost 2 years of work, but it was really worth the effort. Little stuff left to do is mount winch, wet sand & buff out and build belly pan\running boards. Body work takes lots and LOTS of beer!!!! God, Guts and Guns made America and God, Guts and Guns will preserve it! The worst thing you could do is get into my sights, but that don't matter, you'll never know it, cause you'll never hear the shotJim or Paladin whichever you choose.



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