Crap

[chevychic]

Just when I thought I had all the little miscellaneous problems fixed, another pops up. I was really hoping to start spending some time on the interior but that's going to have to wait....again.

Going down the freeway Monday, it started vibrating really bad so I pull off in a little town to find that the vibration is actually a really bad miss. Found a plug wire with some burn marks from being too close to the headers (my looms suck). So I got new plug wires. Well it happens again Wednesday but even worse. Pull off the freeway and take it to another little shop. Mechanic does a compression test on #8 cylinder and it's not firing.
So he suggests adjusting the valves and quoted me 9 hours at $52 an hour. I don't think so!
So I have another problem to tackle that I would really like to tackle myself and save my $$ for other truck stuff.
I've been reading some stuff online and doing some searches, talking to people and it seems like something I could do.

But I would just like some reinforcement, get some tips and hints from the pros on here.
Is there anything I need to be looking for specifically while I'm in there? It seems weird that this happened so suddenly, so I'm almost expecting to have to replace some parts. Maybe this'll be my chance to get new lifters and cam???
I already got some good advice from Tom and Jeremy (thanks guys ) but would like hear more.

I did read up on Swervin's site too. Pretty good information there and I printed it out to use when I dive into it this weekend.

Any advice would be very appreciated

[swervin ervin]

Sounds more like a lobe gone flat or a bad lifter to me than adjusting the valves. Just a side note, hydraulic lifters don't ever need adjusting once they adjusted initially, if done correctly the first time. If it starts skipping and a lifter is the cause, it's a true sign of a lifter collapsing or lobe going flat on the cam.

Man, 9 hours @ $52 bucks an hour to adjust the valves??? I'm in the wrong business.

Since you have already printed out my stuff, you have my hints. But, you know we are here when/if you need us.

Oh, and, sorry to hear of your truck being sick.

[swervin ervin]

Oh, forgot. What type cam are you going for if you do need to replace it? I have a brand new LM1 cam, lifter and pushrod set that I took out of my GM Good wrench engine. Never been ran before. It's yours if you need it if you pay the shipping.

[PHOENIX]

Good luck Heater!
Sorry to hear about that.

[low 84]

i would report that mechanic to the BBB. that is way overrated quote. thats more like a 30 minute job. for a professional mechanic, probly less than that. that is rediculous.

hope you figure it out though

[79BIG10]

I agree that's outrageous!! I'm with Ryan to report him to the BBB. Sounds like he's trying to take you to the cleaners but I'm glad you knew better

If you follow Mike's cam swap it will be very easy since he's got it all there ready for you to follow. Let us know if we can help

[MSL]

Originally posted by swervin ervin
Oh, forgot. What type cam are you going for if you do need to replace it? I have a brand new LM1 cam, lifter and pushrod set that I took out of my GM Good wrench engine. Never been ran before. It's yours if you need it if you pay the shipping.

Look at this if your a women you get a cam for just shipping your so lucky i would jump on that. Sry to hear about the truck i think i have the same problem but i havent tested my cylinder compression i know its number 3 thats where i have a bad plug. As for adjusting valves its not to hard but like it was said above if there hydraulic them its a cam and lifter issue. So what shop was that so i know not to go there.lol

[CHaingKaiShek]

Heather -

Just to be clear on a line in your original post.

"He did a compression check and said the #8 cylinder is not firing."

You mean the compression was low? A compression check just tells you the amount of pressure that the cylinder is creating - not if it's firing or not. Infact it's done with the coil un-powered so the engine will simply rotate.

A spark check can be done by using a good known plug and having someone else crank the engine over while leaving the plug pressed into the boot and laying against a metal part of the body/frame. (Dont hold the wire by hand.)

What I would suggest is the purchase of a cheapie Compression gauge, and that you do the check yourself. It's really simple and it's always better in the long run to do things yourself instead of relying on someone who is obviously trying to rip you off.

If you decide to do your own compression check just remember a few important things.

Remove all spark plugs from the engine in advance. This makes it easier for the starter to spin the assembly.

Remember to have your assistant hold the throttle wide open while cranking the engine, no air in = no compression.

Fuel washes oil from the cylinder walls, meaning that as you go along the compression will drop off as the cylinder walls are cleaned of their oil. If you get a cylinder or two that are drastically lower than the others, pour in a tablespoon of oil into the spark plug hole and try again - see how much the pressure increases and then compair by pouring a tablespoon of oil into a cylinder that is known to have a higher compression ratio.

If you have a cylinder (2-4-6-8 or 1-3-5-7) that reads lower than the others, try replacing the spark plugs into the cylinder(s) next to it, do the compression check over again and see if the pressure changes quite a bit - this could indicate a bad cylinder head gasket failure between cylinders.

Always crank the engine the same number of times per cylinder. So if you crank the engine 10 times on the #1 cylinder, crank the engine over 10 times for each following cylinder you check.

After checking the compression (unless you watched the 'mechanic' do it.) then check for spark. If the spark is weak replace your coil and check for improvement.

Or if you want just run through the lash settings for the valves again. I recommend buying a set of 'rocker arm deflectors' which you clip onto the rocker arms, they keep the oil from splashing all over the place (if your engine is like mine, the oil flow is good. )

Feel free to ask any other questions.

Good luck,

Jeff

[chevychic]

Jeff,

I'm not sure exactly what he meant. That's just what he said. I was there in the garage with him, but I also had my 2 year old daughter with me so I was pre-occupied trying to keep her from getting into everything

I agree, I'd rather do a check myself to see the readings for myself. He probably just quickly said that rather than giving me the readings thinking I wouldn't understand. He also suggested that my husband adjust the valves (assuming I wouldn't or couldn't) so I think he was figuring I'm a normal girl. That's ok, sometimes I let them think that....I get more help that way...and free stuff since he could've charged me for looking at my truck in the first place but didn't.

Also, I was wrong in my previous post, it's not the #8 cylinder. It's the #7 and the plug is fouled and the wire turned out to be bad. I've replaced all the wires and will be replacing the plug as soon as I get to the parts store to get one.

Mike: Thanks!! If it turns out needing those, I'll PM you.



I don't have a written quote to actually go to the BBB with and he didn't charge me anything to spend 30 minutes looking at it. So I'm going to let it go. But I'm thinking of calling him and asking what exactly he would do if I brought it in.

[86SILVERADO]

Hey chevy chic,
I would do a complete tune-up before I go worrying about flat cam lobes. Cap, rotor, all plugs and wires will probably do the trick. If that doesn't work then replace the coil in the cap. Funny story...I was changing the oil in my truck and had it up on the ramps. When I went to start it I could not for the life of me get the thing to fire up. Plenty of gas in it, checked for fuel in carb, checked for spark by exactly the method already outlined only I just watched for spark between the connector of the wire and the top crossmember. I just do this because it is a little harder to see the spark in the gap of the plug. you can clamp the wire to the top of the crossmember around the hood latch area and the tip can even be about a half an inch from the metal area of the truck. If everything in your ignition system is healthy you should see a nice wide fat blue spark If you use this method you can look through the windshield under the hood at the wire while you are cranking the engine (best to do at night but can be done in the day) just harder to see. If the spark is yellow it should run o.k. but could probably use a tuneup at least in the near future. If it is thin and white the truck is either not running or will really need a tune-up bad.
The spark did look a little weak so I replaced the wires and it still would not fire although it sounded like it wanted to which was a slight improvement. I took out all the plugs and put them to the wire brush on my grinder and replaced them and the darn thing almost started but still wouldn't run. I screwed around with the coil in the cap but that didn't work either. checked engine ground and it seemed good and clean and tight. made real sure that the thing was in park, replaced the battery. I was getting pretty pissed by this time. I actually gave up and went back to it the next day and still no go. I had even taken the cap and rotor off and they looked o.k. to me. they didn't even need the contacts scraped. I finally said the hell with it and went down to the parts store and asked for the best darn plugs, cap, rotor, and wires that they could sell me. I also got a new air filter as well. I took them back and put everything in and it fired right up. I think that we all can see the moral of this story.
Good luck,

Norris

[1FaastC10]

Originally posted by 86SILVERADO
I think that we all can see the moral of this story.

throw a bunch of parts and money at it and hope to god that it fixes it? :scratches head:

[Mike76251]

I second what Norris said above,
Go to a NAPA or The Chevy Parts counter when you go for the stuff for the tune up.
The crap most Autozones "type" stores sell is really marginal. Esp. if you use the vehicle to carry a child around.
If one spark plug wire went out the rest are probably needing replacement.
It is a kinda a fun little project and certainly not hard.

[chevychic]

Thanks for the tips guys, but I had already done a tune up and replaced the plugs, cap, and rotor. The ONLY thing I didn't replace at that time were the plug wires. I had the set but they were the wrong ones. I didn't realize they were in such bad shape until this started happening. So I have replaced the wires but haven't driven the truck since doing so. I picked up a compression tester and am going to do a compression check on all cylinders this weekend to see if I can't have a better idea of what might be going on.
I'm hoping all it needed was the new plug and plug wire but that still doesn't explain why there was a bad compression reading on #7. So I'm going to get the reading myself and see what turns up.
Now I just hope it doesn't rain since all I have is a carport and I hate working in that thing.

[Grim Reaper]

Originally posted by chevychic
Jeff,

I'm not sure exactly what he meant. That's just what he said. I was there in the garage with him, but I also had my 2 year old daughter with me so I was pre-occupied trying to keep her from getting into everything

I agree, I'd rather do a check myself to see the readings for myself. He probably just quickly said that rather than giving me the readings thinking I wouldn't understand. He also suggested that my husband adjust the valves (assuming I wouldn't or couldn't) so I think he was figuring I'm a normal girl. That's ok, sometimes I let them think that....I get more help that way...and free stuff since he could've charged me for looking at my truck in the first place but didn't.

Also, I was wrong in my previous post, it's not the #8 cylinder. It's the #7 and the plug is fouled and the wire turned out to be bad. I've replaced all the wires and will be replacing the plug as soon as I get to the parts store to get one.

Mike: Thanks!! If turns out needing those, I'll PM you.



I don't have a written quote to actually go to the BBB with and he didn't charge me anything to spend 30 minutes looking at it. So I'm going to let it go. But I'm thinking of calling him and asking what exactly he would do if I brought it in.

That's BS!. get your truck out of there NOW!
Cam lobs don't sudenly go bad. That's probably an ignition problem or a bad valve guide seal problem fouling the plugs. It's not a bad cam problem. The really bad one would be a burnt valve problem.
If you can't do the repair I would take it somewhere else. It might even be a stuck valve. I had a 95 company van do that and it was a stuck valve. $14 worth of GM top end engine cleaner and a new set of plugs fixed the problem. Then I run the neck of my tech that was letting the thing sit and idle for hours at a time when he was at job sites.

Do a proper compression check on the engine and get the plugs that came out f the engine. pick up a cheap haynes manual and it will have picture of plugs and what the condition of the plug means. You might need $10 worth of valve guide seals and then readjust the valves. It's $50 in parts for gaskets and seals but it is labor intensive and not a novice repair.

[86SILVERADO]

Originally posted by 1FaastC10


throw a bunch of parts and money at it and hope to god that it fixes it? :scratches head:

The moral of the story is throw CAP AND ROTOR AND PLUGS AND WIRES AT IT (No I am not shouting just "emphasizing") and fix the problem nine times out of ten.

I have to wonder how many engines have been re-built because they needed a tune-up. More than one I would guess.

[CustomChevy]

So he suggests adjusting the valves and quoted me 9 hours at $52 an hour. I don't think so!

Waaay too pricey. Just double-check all of your components, test drive it ( now that the plug items have been replaced), and see if the problem is persisting.

If it's still there, then run the compression test with that new gauge you got.


You really want to find out what's happening from an objective view, don't go to a mechanic, take it to your local high school auto shop, let them test it ( as long as shop teacher is present to assist), and they will tell you for free. Shop teacher won't try to screw you, he's just learning the boys (& girls).


Good luck!

[MSL]

Now I just hope it doesn't rain since all I have is a carport and I hate working in that thing

Well it said its supposed to rain this weekend. i know the feeling atleast you have a car port.

[chevychic]

Originally posted by CustomChevy



You really want to find out what's happening from an objective view, don't go to a mechanic, take it to your local high school auto shop, let them test it ( as long as shop teacher is present to assist), and they will tell you for free. Shop teacher won't try to screw you, he's just learning the boys (& girls).


Good luck!

The college I'm attending has an auto shop on the campus. I've considered taking it to them to see if they want to use it as a learning project. Heck, I'll let them use it for several learning projects.

BUT, I also want to learn, which is why I'm so hesitant to take it to the class or to a shop. Most shop insurance policies don't allow customers in the garage and I'm pretty sure that the class instructor at the college won't let me look on since I'm not enrolled in the class.
I just need to find someone around here who won't mind letting me watch, ask questions, and just be involved.

If I still don't have it figured out or fixed by Monday, I'm going to get in touch with the college shop instructor.

[Mike76251]

Originally posted by chevychic


The college I'm attending has an auto shop on the campus. I've considered taking it to them to see if they want to use it as a learning project.

Heck, why do you need to do this when there are people like me around on this forum that will tell you "almost" anything about cars you need to know.
I know "hands on" means a lot but this is waaay cheaper.
I spent $40,000 on Auburn University to get a piece of paper but as soon as I left the place I had to learn a whole new field 'cause what I wound up doing was too new to the world to learn at school.

[82 Silverado 4X]

Watch out if you take your truck to a technical school to have work done that will take more than an overnight stay. My brother had some stereo equipment ripped from his when he left it to have it painted. Good Luck finding your problem.

[MSL]

Heather do you have a manual like a chiltion or haynes to read up on. I just changed my cap and rotor need to do my wires but that helped my truck some i also readjusted my carb now i need to check the timing and redo it. i have to adjust my valves sooner or later. but anyways if you dont have a manual i have one thats a chiltion for the year 80-87 pickups i dont need it since my trucks a 78 . so if you need it it's yours let me know.

[1FaastC10]

Originally posted by Mike76251


Heck, why do you need to do this when there are people like me around on this forum that will tell you "almost" anything about cars you need to know.

TOO FUNNY! i've been through 3 years of formal training in the automotive field, and i've been working in cars for the last 12 and a half years. i've yet to get to the point where i am so full of myself that i make a statement like that though. thanks for the laugh Mike!

[chevychic]

Originally posted by MSL
Heather do you have a manual like a chiltion or haynes to read up on. I just changed my cap and rotor need to do my wires but that helped my truck some i also readjusted my carb now i need to check the timing and redo it. i have to adjust my valves sooner or later. but anyways if you dont have a manual i have one thats a chiltion for the year 80-87 pickups i dont need it since my trucks a 78 . so if you need it it's yours let me know.

Thanks!! I actually have a Chiltons for my truck. Now if it were a Haynes you were offering, I'd snatch it up!!

BTW: Were you at Schucks over by Harry & David today? I saw a truck there that looked like yours.

[MSL]

Ok just thought i would offer it to you. I was at shucks about a hour ago. i needed some new wires but they had nothing but cheapos in stock and im not using megaspark on my truck.lol those are the worse wires i have ever used in my life on anything domestic and foreign.

[chevychic]

Yep, that was you. I was just leaving McGraths with my mom about that time.

I get all my parts from Littrell. on Biddle Rd. The guys over there are really cool and Ray always puts up with my silly questions. If the south side of town is closer for you like it is for me, the auto section in Blackbird is also part of Littrell and carry some good quality stuff.