Clarification needed - Brakes and steering

[Figuarus]

Hey guys,

I'm about ready to start getting my components for updating my control arms, ball joints, brakes and power steering.

I've found an 87 C10 That I plan on taking the entire crossmember (arms, spindles, coils, rotors, steering linkage, and Steering gearbox) and rebuild everything before I install everything into the truck.

It's my understanding that I will have to drill 2 more holes in my frame when I bolt the crossmember in, and will need to use the linkage from the 87 in order to make everything work. Additionally, I need to use the HD C10 spindles in order to use a 6 lug rotor, correct?

My understanding on a few things are kind of murky.

Can I use my NON Power steering Gearbox with the 87 linkage, or are the pitman arms that different? The reason I ask this is because I don't have any bracketry for the pump, and stuff. plus, I think my alternator is currently in the way of where the pump would go...



Second, once I bolt on the adaptor bracket from Captain fab, I will have to lengthen the connecting rod that run through the Booster, correct? And I've seen some posts that mention and show having to relocate the attachment point of the brake pedal linkage? Why is this necessary? I would assume that since the only thing you are doing is making the rod longer, you wouldn't need to relocate it.

Little help?

TL : DR Questions:
Use HD C10 Rotors to retain 6 lug bolt pattern?
Is there any parts store equivalent to the aftermarket 6 lug rotors from ECE?
Can you use the non-PS gearbox with the 87 C10 steering linkage?
I have to lengthen *AND* relocate the brake booster rod?

Bonus question, Can anyone provide me a picture of how their power steering and alternator are installed on a 283?

[pimpston65]

Originally Posted by Figuarus

Hey guys,

I'm about ready to start getting my components for updating my control arms, ball joints, brakes and power steering.

I've found an 87 C10 That I plan on taking the entire crossmember (arms, spindles, coils, rotors, steering linkage, and Steering gearbox) and rebuild everything before I install everything into the truck.

It's my understanding that I will have to drill 2 more holes in my frame when I bolt the crossmember in, and will need to use the linkage from the 87 in order to make everything work. Additionally, I need to use the HD C10 spindles in order to use a 6 lug rotor, correct?

My understanding on a few things are kind of murky.

Can I use my NON Power steering Gearbox with the 87 linkage, or are the pitman arms that different? The reason I ask this is because I don't have any bracketry for the pump, and stuff. plus, I think my alternator is currently in the way of where the pump would go...



Second, once I bolt on the adaptor bracket from Captain fab, I will have to lengthen the connecting rod that run through the Booster, correct? And I've seen some posts that mention and show having to relocate the attachment point of the brake pedal linkage? Why is this necessary? I would assume that since the only thing you are doing is making the rod longer, you wouldn't need to relocate it.

Little help?

TL : DR Questions:
Use HD C10 Rotors to retain 6 lug bolt pattern?
Is there any parts store equivalent to the aftermarket 6 lug rotors from ECE?
Can you use the non-PS gearbox with the 87 C10 steering linkage?
I have to lengthen *AND* relocate the brake booster rod?

Bonus question, Can anyone provide me a picture of how their power steering and alternator are installed on a 283?

how bout, whats the cord going into the valve cover???

[Figuarus]

> how bout, whats the cord going into the valve cover???

Oh, I had the oil pressure line disconnected. I had to run it somewhere...

[Jeff La]

years ago you could buy a jumper line just like that to bring oil up to the top of the engine for valve rattle. We used it on a old Ford we rebuilt than went mud riding. That engine didn't last long. LOL

[TopFuel1966]

Originally Posted by Figuarus

Hey guys,

I'm about ready to start getting my components for updating my control arms, ball joints, brakes and power steering.

I've found an 87 C10 That I plan on taking the entire crossmember (arms, spindles, coils, rotors, steering linkage, and Steering gearbox) and rebuild everything before I install everything into the truck.

It's my understanding that I will have to drill 2 more holes in my frame when I bolt the crossmember in, and will need to use the linkage from the 87 in order to make everything work. Additionally, I need to use the HD C10 spindles in order to use a 6 lug rotor, correct?

My understanding on a few things are kind of murky.

Can I use my NON Power steering Gearbox with the 87 linkage, or are the pitman arms that different? The reason I ask this is because I don't have any bracketry for the pump, and stuff. plus, I think my alternator is currently in the way of where the pump would go...



Second, once I bolt on the adaptor bracket from Captain fab, I will have to lengthen the connecting rod that run through the Booster, correct? And I've seen some posts that mention and show having to relocate the attachment point of the brake pedal linkage? Why is this necessary? I would assume that since the only thing you are doing is making the rod longer, you wouldn't need to relocate it.

Little help?

TL : DR Questions:
Use HD C10 Rotors to retain 6 lug bolt pattern?
Is there any parts store equivalent to the aftermarket 6 lug rotors from ECE?
Can you use the non-PS gearbox with the 87 C10 steering linkage?
I have to lengthen *AND* relocate the brake booster rod?

Bonus question, Can anyone provide me a picture of how their power steering and alternator are installed on a 283?

You need to change the attachment point on the pedal arm because manual brakes use about a 6:1 ratio as opposed to power brakes which use about a 4:1 ratio.

http://www.mpbrakes.com/techtalk/how...ng-pedal-ratio

[Captainfab]

I do not know if the original pitman arm will fit the later model draglink as I have not tried that. I do know that a power steering pitman arm will fit an original '63-'66 draglink.

Yes your alternator is where the power steering pump needs to be. Why was it moved down there?

[Figuarus]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

Yes your alternator is where the power steering pump needs to be. Why was it moved down there?

Honestly? I have absolutely no idea. I think my brother thought it would be cool.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Figuarus]

So with the pedal removed, is there a standard "drill here" spot on the arm, or is it all based on what booster you use?

[Figuarus]

So, after doing more reading, i've come across some information posted in the FAQ section.

1964C10 posted something about using an 88 spindle with the 1.25" thick rotors, and was able to use rotors from a 90 Chev.

Does that sound about right? I would assume the bearings will be the same, right?

The ball joints from an 87/88 would fit the 64 control arms, right?

[Palf70Step]

I know when I upgraded my old 70 C10 with an 86 front end, I used a stock 72 power steering box & pitman arm, as well as the 70 idler arm with the 86 cross/drag link. No issues.

I have not tried the 88 & up spindle change. 87 in the C10 was the final year that I know swap with ours. I am pretty sure the 88-98 years because of the steering box relocation to the inside of the frame, the spindles and all are a bit different. I cannot remember all the details of what it takes to use the 88 & up spindles/rotors. I think u have to use 3/4 ton (C20 a-arms to make it work.

[Figuarus]

Originally Posted by Palf70Step

I know when I upgraded my old 70 C10 with an 86 front end, I used a stock 72 power steering box & pitman arm, as well as the 70 idler arm with the 86 cross/drag link. No issues.

yep.

So here's where i'm at:

I have a tentative list of what parts i'm using.

87 HD spindles (the ones that come with 1.25" rotors)
1990 1.25" 6 lug rotors
A3/A5 Bearings
87 Brake Calipers
87 Brake pads
87 Ball joints (upper /lower )
1964 upper and lower control arms ( These will be changed at a later date)
87 Steering linkage, pitman arm, idler, inner/outer tie rods, and steering box
Captain Fab's booster adapter bracket
Lengthening of the booster rod
Changing of the clevis location ( pedal ratio change )
Split brake lines (front/rear)


Have I got this right? Anything else i've missed?

[lolife99]

Originally Posted by Figuarus

So, after doing more reading, i've come across some information posted in the FAQ section.

1964C10 posted something about using an 88 spindle with the 1.25" thick rotors, and was able to use rotors from a 90 Chev.

Does that sound about right? I would assume the bearings will be the same, right?

The ball joints from an 87/88 would fit the 64 control arms, right?

Originally Posted by Figuarus

yep.

So here's where i'm at:

I have a tentative list of what parts i'm using.

87 HD spindles (the ones that come with 1.25" rotors)
1990 1.25" 6 lug rotors
A3/A5 Bearings
87 Brake Calipers
87 Brake pads
87 Ball joints (upper /lower )
1964 upper and lower control arms ( These will be changed at a later date)
87 Steering linkage, pitman arm, idler, inner/outer tie rods, and steering box
Captain Fab's booster adapter bracket
Lengthening of the booster rod
Changing of the clevis location ( pedal ratio change )
Split brake lines (front/rear)


Have I got this right? Anything else i've missed?

Man,... you are all over the place with your info.
You are combining to different versions of swap parts too get 6-lug disc brakes.

Start at the beginning.
Use your 87 donor parts with after market 6-lug rotors.
You are on the right track.
Your only concern was the pitman arm, which I can't answer for sure,... but at the very minimum it will require a pitman arm change.

Now,... the second swap using 88-98 hubs and rotors.
This is a more complex swap if you will look on the board.
And the end results have netted a positive camber issue that can't be cured with a simple front end alignment.
This swap if you choose to go that way, (which I would not) requires:
88-98 parts:
Spindles
Rotors
Hubs
Balljoints
Outer tie rods.
You will also need 63-87 C20 lower control arms with the larger ball joint hole to fit the 88-98 lower balljoint.

Again,... The only successful member to pull this off had to relocate the lower mounting point of the lower a-arms to address the positive camber issue.
Most spend the same or MORE money to do this swap.

Just my 2 cents,...

[lolife99]

My understanding of trying to use the 88-98 6-lug hub and rotor on the 73-87 spindle results in the caliper not lining up correctly.

My other thoughts are using a 88-98 spindle on the 60-87 frame is that the geometry of the suspension would be off, since they are totally different.
Just because parts physically bolt together, doesn't mean they will function correctly.
Don't try to reinvent the wheel so to speak.

If you do,... switch to Porterbuilt, Hotchkis, RoadsterShop, or some of the other big name suspension companies that have corrected all the bad issues with the c10 front end.
But be prepared to open your wallet,...

[Figuarus]

Posted via Mobile Device

[Figuarus]

Ok. I know im all over the place. Thats why im posting here because all the information, while plentiful, is very confusing.

So I CANNOT use the 88 and newer stuff. Use 87 and older, correct?
Posted via Mobile Device

[lolife99]

Originally Posted by Figuarus

Ok. I know im all over the place. Thats why im posting here because all the information, while plentiful, is very confusing.

So I CANNOT use the 88 and newer stuff. Use 87 and older, correct?
Posted via Mobile Device

I would stay away from the 88-98 parts.

The 6-lug rotors that CPP and MANY other vendors sell,... are just blank 5-lug rotors that have been re-drilled to the 6-lug pattern.
They use a long proven 63-87 suspension design, that will give you years of trouble free miles.
Some say,... "I can't get these rotors at my local parts store".
So what.
With mail order companies like Rock Auto, and free shipping offered by Jegs and Summit Racing,... there is no reason to not wait a few days to get parts anymore.
Just my opinion,...

[lolife99]

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=211456

[lolife99]

Look at this thread for 88-98 issues,...
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=620262

BEST QUOTE OF THE ABOVE THREAD:
ok, I said i would report back when i knew if my fix worked, and it did. However, I'm just simply going to say that if your considering using 88-98 spindles to do a disc brake swap, don't. I safely made mine work only because I am so deeply invested in it with new a arms, ball joints, rotors, calipers, tie rod ends, and a ton of time that I felt compelled to make it work. I plan to only run this for as long as it take me to get an air bag kit with upper and lower arms that I can use and still retain my 6 lug wheels. I will be glad to PM with anyone that is in the same boat as me as to how I made it work, but will simply say to those that are researching about the swap.....BUY a KIT!!!

[lolife99]

Best deal on a pair of 6-lug conversion rotors.
http://m.summitracing.com/parts/clp-cp4r-6

[Figuarus]

lolife, you're right.

If I order on time, I shouldn't have any issues with using mail order parts.

It's always nice to have a local place you can go to, but you're right.

So, according to what i'm seeing, my parts list is ok, but use parts only spanning to 1987, correct?

[lolife99]

Originally Posted by Figuarus

lolife, you're right.

If I order on time, I shouldn't have any issues with using mail order parts.

It's always nice to have a local place you can go to, but you're right.

So, according to what i'm seeing, my parts list is ok, but use parts only spanning to 1987, correct?

yes.
With HD 1.25" spindles and aftermarket 6-lug rotors.
(or 5-lug oem rotors)