Has ne1 used a two link rather than 4? - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

Slammed '87 · 11-11-2003, 09:18 PM

I am considering installing a custom 2 link in the rear of my '87 and was just curious if anyone else in here has went this route, and if so how does it ride? Here is a pik from ekstensive, it is for a newer GMC, but basically the same idea. Thanks.

cdowns · 11-11-2003, 09:35 PM

on my 71c10 with coil springs a 2like was stock and it's worked good for over 30years

GMC JUNKIE TOO · 11-11-2003, 11:02 PM

My buddy has a setup exactly like that on his 93. another guy I know helped him build it from scratch, he hasent had any problems and gets a decent ride and plenty of lift.

BaggedC10 · 11-11-2003, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cdowns
on my 71c10 with coil springs a 2like was stock and it's worked good for over 30years

There's a BIG difference between a trailing arm setup and a 2-link.

Simply put, 2-links are inferior. A 4-link has a greater range of motion and will not cause drivetrain/chassis damage. If you only "show" your truck, then a 2-link would be fine. Either way, why install a half-@ss setup?

Slammed '87 · 11-12-2003, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BaggedC10

There's a BIG difference between a trailing arm setup and a 2-link.

Simply put, 2-links are inferior. A 4-link has a greater range of motion and will not cause drivetrain/chassis damage. If you only "show" your truck, then a 2-link would be fine. Either way, why install a half-@ss setup?

....Is this just your opinion, or do you have something to back this up??? I fail to see where a 4 link could have a "greater range of motion" and how a 2 link would cause "drivetrain/chassis damage". I could see a 4 link being a little stronger, and maybe go that route if i was planning on having a super fast drag truck, but i am not. I could understand all your points if the 2 link wasn't installed properly, but the same goes for a 4 link. A 2 link and a 4 link are basically the same thing or idea, cept the 2 link is just one heavy duty arm, whereas a 4 link is two small arms. And as for "half @ss setup" ??? I could get more lift if i went with a 2 over the typical 4 link, and it would look much better aswell (i think) If it rides the same as 4 link, then i don't see why it would be a half @ss setup, or is this just what "you think"?

Anyone who has actually installed and ran a two link, please let me know all the technical posative and negative benefits, and pointers, as i will be fabricating it from scratch! Cheers!!!

BaggedC10 · 11-12-2003, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Slammed '87

....Is this just your opinion, or do you have something to back this up??? I fail to see where a 4 link could have a "greater range of motion" and how a 2 link would cause "drivetrain/chassis damage". I could see a 4 link being a little stronger, and maybe go that route if i was planning on having a super fast drag truck, but i am not. I could understand all your points if the 2 link wasn't installed properly, but the same goes for a 4 link. A 2 link and a 4 link are basically the same thing or idea, cept the 2 link is just one heavy duty arm, whereas a 4 link is two small arms. And as for "half @ss setup" ??? I could get more lift if i went with a 2 over the typical 4 link, and it would look much better aswell (i think) If it rides the same as 4 link, then i don't see why it would be a half @ss setup, or is this just what "you think"?

Anyone who has actually installed and ran a two link, please let me know all the technical posative and negative benefits, and pointers, as i will be fabricating it from scratch! Cheers!!!

Is there a reason you are getting defensive?

Two links are simply inferior. The pinion angle changes can be massive. This really becomes an issue because they are so easy to make cantilevers out of. The more travel, the more the pinion angle changes. Another reason is poor axle articulation. The way I describe them to people, is that they turn the rear axle housing into an anti-sway bar. For one side to go up, something has to twist. With the axle housing bolted between them, that is what is trying to twist---However, it does not. The bushings flex as far as possible and something has to give. Usually, the mounts break loose and usually from the axle housing. I could not believe a shop with an excellent repuation that Ekstensive Metal Works has, decided to mass produce such a poor design.

Chevy Wrench · 11-12-2003, 02:26 AM

Also, with the 2 link, the axle moves up and down in an arc. Causing the pinion angle to change drasticly, and the yoke tends to " pull" away from the trans. On the 4 link, the axle moves staight up and down, no arc. Therefore, the pinion does not change, and your axle isnt working against itself. As far as Extensive building that hunk of ( fill in your own words), I think Aim industries came out with that design a few years back. I could be wrong about that though. Plus, why do you want more lift anyway? If you arent getting full lift out of your bags, try reconfiguing your bag mounts. From your name, I would think you wanted to get more drop insted of lift.

BaggedC10 · 11-12-2003, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chevy Wrench
Also, with the 2 link, the axle moves up and down in an arc. Causing the pinion angle to change drasticly, and the yoke tends to " pull" away from the trans. On the 4 link, the axle moves staight up and down, no arc. Therefore, the pinion does not change, and your axle isnt working against itself. As far as Extensive building that hunk of ( fill in your own words), I think Aim industries came out with that design a few years back. I could be wrong about that though. Plus, why do you want more lift anyway? If you arent getting full lift out of your bags, try reconfiguing your bag mounts. From your name, I would think you wanted to get more drop insted of lift.

Yep. A 2-link is mounted in a "ridgid" form and allows for very little side-to-side movement. I am also curious why people (Speaking in general) want more lift. I understand if you encounter steep inclines on a daily basis but Slammed87 obviously doesn't w/ a 7/12"(?) static drop.

Slammed '87 · 11-12-2003, 02:42 AM

Don't get me wrong dude, i am not getting defensive, just what you are saying makes no sence to me. You are saying the pinion angle is too great. Well it's not any different than lowering anyother way. That is what the yoke is for, suspension (driveshaft) travel!!! A two link is basically like a leaf spring, except does not attach to the shackle. And you as for the twisting, how many leaf springs have you seen that were twisted off? It's the same thing!!! As for why i want as much drop as possable, i live in Calgary Alberta. Yeah i have a 7/12 drop now, but there are ALOT of places i can't drive. I would like to be actually able to drive my truck places and not do damage. Roads here are REALLY bad! And like you mentioned ekstensive having a good rep, i am sure they would know a little more about a 2 link then you, and have done the research!

BaggedC10 · 11-12-2003, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Slammed '87
Don't get me wrong dude, i am not getting defensive, just what you are saying makes no sence to me. You are saying the pinion angle is too great. Well it's not any different than lowering anyother way. That is what the yoke is for, suspension (driveshaft) travel!!! A two link is basically like a leaf spring, except does not attach to the shackle. And you as for the twisting, how many leaf springs have you seen that were twisted off? It's the same thing!!! As for why i want as much drop as possable, i live in Calgary Alberta. Yeah i have a 7/12 drop now, but there are ALOT of places i can't drive. I would like to be actually able to drive my truck places and not do damage. Roads here are REALLY bad! And like you mentioned ekstensive having a good rep, i am sure they would know a little more about a 2 link then you, and have done the research!

1. It's obvious you don't understand (No offense). Saying a 2-link and leaf spring setup are "the same" is laughable.

2. There's no question---Air ride is the only way to go, especially in your case.

3. Have done the research.....Sure they have! That doesn't mean it is w/o flaw or a poor design.

With that said, we could argue for days. Good luck w/ whatever you decide and hopefully others will reply w/ more information.

Slammed '87 · 11-12-2003, 02:59 AM

Actcually i think it's you that doesn't understand, but i agree i need someone's tried and true facts who has done a 2 link b4 as over inexperienced opinion

Chevy Wrench · 11-12-2003, 03:24 AM

This is going to become a shouting match if we all arent careful. Slammed87, we are only trying to help you, thats all. The facts are as follows; The 4 link has been around for decades, it is very strong, and reliable. This 2 link has been on the market for what, a year at best? Has anyone that you know of done any R & D on it? Im not talking about Extensive's own results, but then if you did know someone who has, you wouldnt be posting this thread. What is the cost difference? The average 4 link cost about $400, Im sure thats about half of the 2 link. And what Baggedc10 was saying is that the leaf spring is completely different from any type of link bar set up.

lost wages · 11-12-2003, 03:30 AM

didnt they just go over this at sporttruck.com ? do a search over there and there is alot of info about it. 4 links are the way to go once you understand how the pinion angle changes greatly throught the arc with a 2 link. A 4 link is superior in every way except ease of design, but you can get a bolt on 4 link for that truck.

Slammed '87 · 11-12-2003, 03:33 AM

Yes yes yes i know that the 4 link has been around, and is here to stay!!! .... What i originally wanted to know was how are the 2 links for handling, ride etc. I thank you for your input, but like i asked @ the beginning of this thread, was for info about the 2 link from someone who has used this setup! YES i have seen two articles b4 in mag's, if i have time i will look them up again, i believe in one, Sport Truck used this setup on an 88. I am just trying to find more real input, i mean, not opinion based. I appreciate you wanting to steer me clear of a possible "bad" product. cheers!

Chevy Wrench · 11-12-2003, 03:37 AM

No problem, good luck with your decision.

jamis · 11-12-2003, 08:08 AM

I dont see any thing wrong with the two link, it is the same principle used in our trucks form the sixties to the early seventies, only its call a trailering arm. The ladder bar set up is also a two link. The four link gives you, as you guys say a more stable or constant pinion angle. Four links also provide you with more adjustments, if you buy the higher end setups.

However I dont agree with the opinion that a two link is a "half ass setup" and "This 2 link has been on the market for what, a year at best". It has and will still be used for a long time. Four link is better, but the 2 link works as well.

In fact I would stick with my trailering arms rather then buy some of those cheap $99 4 link setups you see in the magazines.

Izzy · 11-12-2003, 10:11 AM

Another associated problem with the 2 link is the bag is mounted outboard of the link and to get the best out of that setup you need to cove the frame and place the bag directly over the link bar.

2 links and trailing arms from pre 73’s are a little different. The pre 73 trams are mounted at an angle so they allow more articulation when moving side/side. The 2 link is mounted straight so if you go up an incline on the right side your opposite wheel is going to pick up off the ground it’s a fact.

It’s a decent setup for the average person but imo you could drop that $700 or so on a nice parallel 4 link and get a superior ride and not have to worry about breaking an axle saddle, ripping up your bushings or blowing a ujoint.

BaggedC10 · 11-12-2003, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fiveeightchevy
2 links and trailing arms from pre 73’s are a little different. The pre 73 trams are mounted at an angle so they allow more articulation when moving side/side.

The length of the pre-73 trailing arms is also a key factor.

Izzy · 11-12-2003, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BaggedC10

The length of the pre-73 trailing arms is also a key factor.

Correctamundo.

rodnok1 · 11-12-2003, 12:21 PM

A two link looks like way too much work and reinventing the wheel, a trailing arm setup is simple and be bought aftermarket pretty much complete, A 4-link is great, but is alot harder to setup. Just would depend to me on how much cash I had...

jamis · 11-12-2003, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BaggedC10

The length of the pre-73 trailing arms is also a key factor.

I agree the longer the arm the less effect to pinion angle during travel.

Izzy · 11-12-2003, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rodnok1
A two link looks like way too much work and reinventing the wheel, a trailing arm setup is simple and be bought aftermarket pretty much complete, A 4-link is great, but is alot harder to setup. Just would depend to me on how much cash I had...

I agree with that a 4 link is a little harder compared to the 2 link but my ART link setup came with the bars set at the correct length so it was a little easier. I had never done a link setup at the time and we got it done in a day.

crazy longhorn · 11-12-2003, 06:34 PM

A 2 link wont "jack" the pinion angles as hard as a set of leaf springs. There is a problem with angles, with the arc the pinion travels on a 2 link......but Ladders are run (and work well with vehicles in the 10sec or slower range). they can also be run on the street, but the ride will be a little "harsher" with a straight 2 link, or ladder bars setup. The longer the bar, the less pinion angle change. I will be running ladders, with coil over next season.......ride is not the main concern, but "bite" is a big issue! crazyL

loweredd · 11-12-2003, 09:20 PM

I wish I would have seen this before the thread got out of hand.

I have a 2 link from Silver Star Customs out of MS. It works 110% great!!! Yes, a 2 link will have problems with pinion angle......................................IF you are getting 3 feet of lift. I have mine as a daily driver now, and it works great! I wouldn't change it if I could do it for free. My bags are mounted directly centered over the bars. I have the bags mounted right by the front spring hangers, and get great lift out of Firestone 2600's. Almost enough to untuck my 32" tires!!

The 2-link has a stabalizer bar that is welded between the two bars and it has NO side to side movement whatsoever. The only movement is from the sidewall on the tire.

Let me know if you have any questions Slammed87. Dont let anyone tell you otherwise.

ShamrockCustoms · 11-12-2003, 10:43 PM

2 links can be ok, but they need to be done the same as OEM trailing arms. based on the photo at top (front of truck is to the left ? hope so), that system will see alot of load on those brackets during any cornering. high, high stress. because of that stress from cornering on a street driver, they should really be triangulated so they dont bind as much and wear out the bushings as fast. (this can happen to ladder bars and 4links)

of course, you will want a stout x-member for the front mount points. they should also be at least around 32" or more, especially considering the wheelbase of a truck. any less would be uncivilized...

whatever you end up doing, good luck!

11-11-2003, 09:18 PM	#1
Slammed '87 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Calgary Canada Posts: 556	Has ne1 used a two link rather than 4? I am considering installing a custom 2 link in the rear of my '87 and was just curious if anyone else in here has went this route, and if so how does it ride? Here is a pik from ekstensive, it is for a newer GMC, but basically the same idea. Thanks. Attached Images

11-11-2003, 09:35 PM	#2
cdowns Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: daytonabeach Posts: 22,956	on my 71c10 with coil springs a 2like was stock and it's worked good for over 30years __________________ 71c-10 350/2004r/4:11 lowered3/4 longbed/dead by hurricane MEANING OF DEATH::::: SOMEBODY ELSE GETS YOUR STUFF DONT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU THINK TAKE MY ADVISE;I DON'T USE IT ANYWAY

11-12-2003, 02:26 AM	#7
Chevy Wrench former desert rat Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: salt lake city, utah Home of the 3 M's Mormons, methlabs and minivans Posts: 320	Also, with the 2 link, the axle moves up and down in an arc. Causing the pinion angle to change drasticly, and the yoke tends to " pull" away from the trans. On the 4 link, the axle moves staight up and down, no arc. Therefore, the pinion does not change, and your axle isnt working against itself. As far as Extensive building that hunk of ( fill in your own words), I think Aim industries came out with that design a few years back. I could be wrong about that though. Plus, why do you want more lift anyway? If you arent getting full lift out of your bags, try reconfiguing your bag mounts. From your name, I would think you wanted to get more drop insted of lift. __________________ 94 Chevy Silverado Ext cab 4/6 drop w/ 18's and 2500watt system (work truck). 67 Chevy swb under const. frame off custom, 20's, bagged and a large rat under the hood,and a 1940 Chevy truck under const.

11-12-2003, 02:59 AM	#11
Slammed '87 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Calgary Canada Posts: 556	Actcually i think it's you that doesn't understand, but i agree i need someone's tried and true facts who has done a 2 link b4 as over inexperienced opinion __________________ If you can't rock the roads with your bumpers 1/2" off the ground, you're nowhere near low enough!

11-12-2003, 03:24 AM	#12
Chevy Wrench former desert rat Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: salt lake city, utah Home of the 3 M's Mormons, methlabs and minivans Posts: 320	This is going to become a shouting match if we all arent careful. Slammed87, we are only trying to help you, thats all. The facts are as follows; The 4 link has been around for decades, it is very strong, and reliable. This 2 link has been on the market for what, a year at best? Has anyone that you know of done any R & D on it? Im not talking about Extensive's own results, but then if you did know someone who has, you wouldnt be posting this thread. What is the cost difference? The average 4 link cost about $400, Im sure thats about half of the 2 link. And what Baggedc10 was saying is that the leaf spring is completely different from any type of link bar set up. __________________ 94 Chevy Silverado Ext cab 4/6 drop w/ 18's and 2500watt system (work truck). 67 Chevy swb under const. frame off custom, 20's, bagged and a large rat under the hood,and a 1940 Chevy truck under const.

11-11-2003, 11:02 PM	#3
GMC JUNKIE TOO THE QUICKER FIXERUPER Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Ok Posts: 615	My buddy has a setup exactly like that on his 93. another guy I know helped him build it from scratch, he hasent had any problems and gets a decent ride and plenty of lift.

11-12-2003, 02:42 AM	#9
Slammed '87 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Calgary Canada Posts: 556	Don't get me wrong dude, i am not getting defensive, just what you are saying makes no sence to me. You are saying the pinion angle is too great. Well it's not any different than lowering anyother way. That is what the yoke is for, suspension (driveshaft) travel!!! A two link is basically like a leaf spring, except does not attach to the shackle. And you as for the twisting, how many leaf springs have you seen that were twisted off? It's the same thing!!! As for why i want as much drop as possable, i live in Calgary Alberta. Yeah i have a 7/12 drop now, but there are ALOT of places i can't drive. I would like to be actually able to drive my truck places and not do damage. Roads here are REALLY bad! And like you mentioned ekstensive having a good rep, i am sure they would know a little more about a 2 link then you, and have done the research!

11-12-2003, 03:30 AM	#13
lost wages Registered User Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: jefferson city, mo Posts: 1,364	didnt they just go over this at sporttruck.com ? do a search over there and there is alot of info about it. 4 links are the way to go once you understand how the pinion angle changes greatly throught the arc with a 2 link. A 4 link is superior in every way except ease of design, but you can get a bolt on 4 link for that truck.

11-12-2003, 03:33 AM	#14
Slammed '87 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Calgary Canada Posts: 556	Yes yes yes i know that the 4 link has been around, and is here to stay!!! .... What i originally wanted to know was how are the 2 links for handling, ride etc. I thank you for your input, but like i asked @ the beginning of this thread, was for info about the 2 link from someone who has used this setup! YES i have seen two articles b4 in mag's, if i have time i will look them up again, i believe in one, Sport Truck used this setup on an 88. I am just trying to find more real input, i mean, not opinion based. I appreciate you wanting to steer me clear of a possible "bad" product. cheers!

11-12-2003, 03:37 AM	#15
Chevy Wrench former desert rat Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: salt lake city, utah Home of the 3 M's Mormons, methlabs and minivans Posts: 320	No problem, good luck with your decision. __________________ 94 Chevy Silverado Ext cab 4/6 drop w/ 18's and 2500watt system (work truck). 67 Chevy swb under const. frame off custom, 20's, bagged and a large rat under the hood,and a 1940 Chevy truck under const.

11-12-2003, 08:08 AM	#16
jamis F.A.S.T. president Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Florida Posts: 1,883	I dont see any thing wrong with the two link, it is the same principle used in our trucks form the sixties to the early seventies, only its call a trailering arm. The ladder bar set up is also a two link. The four link gives you, as you guys say a more stable or constant pinion angle. Four links also provide you with more adjustments, if you buy the higher end setups. However I dont agree with the opinion that a two link is a "half ass setup" and "This 2 link has been on the market for what, a year at best". It has and will still be used for a long time. Four link is better, but the 2 link works as well. In fact I would stick with my trailering arms rather then buy some of those cheap $99 4 link setups you see in the magazines. Last edited by jamis; 11-12-2003 at 08:14 AM.

11-12-2003, 10:11 AM	#17
Izzy Trucker. Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 1,364	Another associated problem with the 2 link is the bag is mounted outboard of the link and to get the best out of that setup you need to cove the frame and place the bag directly over the link bar. 2 links and trailing arms from pre 73’s are a little different. The pre 73 trams are mounted at an angle so they allow more articulation when moving side/side. The 2 link is mounted straight so if you go up an incline on the right side your opposite wheel is going to pick up off the ground it’s a fact. It’s a decent setup for the average person but imo you could drop that $700 or so on a nice parallel 4 link and get a superior ride and not have to worry about breaking an axle saddle, ripping up your bushings or blowing a ujoint.

11-12-2003, 12:21 PM	#20
rodnok1 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Linden, North Carolina Posts: 617	A two link looks like way too much work and reinventing the wheel, a trailing arm setup is simple and be bought aftermarket pretty much complete, A 4-link is great, but is alot harder to setup. Just would depend to me on how much cash I had... __________________ 64 Panel Rebuild Pics Clutch Replacement and Borg Warner T10 Trans Rebuild 64 Panel 1/2 Ton 350cubes/400hp BorgWarner t-10 3:73 Auburn Posi

11-12-2003, 06:34 PM	#23
crazy longhorn Fabricate till you "puke" Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ill Posts: 9,402	A 2 link wont "jack" the pinion angles as hard as a set of leaf springs. There is a problem with angles, with the arc the pinion travels on a 2 link......but Ladders are run (and work well with vehicles in the 10sec or slower range). they can also be run on the street, but the ride will be a little "harsher" with a straight 2 link, or ladder bars setup. The longer the bar, the less pinion angle change. I will be running ladders, with coil over next season.......ride is not the main concern, but "bite" is a big issue! crazyL __________________ 69 longhorn,4" chop,3/5 drop, 1/2 ton suspension/disc brakes,1 1/2" body drop,steel tilt clip, 5.3/Edelbrock rpm intake/600 carb, Hooker streetrod shorties,2 1/2" exhaust/ H pipe/50's Flows , 6 spd Richmond trans,12 bolt/ 3.40 gears....

11-12-2003, 09:20 PM	#24
loweredd www.loweredd.com Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Struble IA Posts: 808	I wish I would have seen this before the thread got out of hand. I have a 2 link from Silver Star Customs out of MS. It works 110% great!!! Yes, a 2 link will have problems with pinion angle......................................IF you are getting 3 feet of lift. I have mine as a daily driver now, and it works great! I wouldn't change it if I could do it for free. My bags are mounted directly centered over the bars. I have the bags mounted right by the front spring hangers, and get great lift out of Firestone 2600's. Almost enough to untuck my 32" tires!! The 2-link has a stabalizer bar that is welded between the two bars and it has NO side to side movement whatsoever. The only movement is from the sidewall on the tire. Let me know if you have any questions Slammed87. Dont let anyone tell you otherwise.



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11-12-2003, 10:43 PM	#25
ShamrockCustoms Project56 on hold Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 489	yes and no 2 links can be ok, but they need to be done the same as OEM trailing arms. based on the photo at top (front of truck is to the left ? hope so), that system will see alot of load on those brackets during any cornering. high, high stress. because of that stress from cornering on a street driver, they should really be triangulated so they dont bind as much and wear out the bushings as fast. (this can happen to ladder bars and 4links) of course, you will want a stout x-member for the front mount points. they should also be at least around 32" or more, especially considering the wheelbase of a truck. any less would be uncivilized... whatever you end up doing, good luck! __________________ Shamrock Customs Forever-in-the-Future Custom Shop 2009 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS daily driver 1956 Chevy Stepside rodstoration on winter hold Last edited by ShamrockCustoms; 11-12-2003 at 10:46 PM.

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