47-59 needing a wiring diagram

[GasWorksGarage]

Looking for a wiring diagram for a 58 Apache Cameo 6 cylinder.

Thanks in advance!

[_Ogre]

what do you need help with? not much electrical on our trucks
stock truck never had a fuse panel unless it had electric wipers

[GasWorksGarage]

Originally Posted by _Ogre

what do you need help with? not much electrical on our trucks
stock truck never had a fuse panel unless it had electric wipers

ok well here goes,
headlights off - right signal on - only right front flashes - left signal on- left front and both rears flash.

headlights on - front marker and low beams work- no hi beam.
rear lights - left very dim right very bright like brake light.

right signal on right front flashes - right rear no flash just very dim.

left signal on left front very slow flash - left rear no flash very bright.

thoughts?

[mongocanfly]

Are your grounds good?

[GasWorksGarage]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

Are your grounds good?

yes they seem good. I took the off and cleaned them.

[mongocanfly]

deleted

[GasWorksGarage]

I should also add the the left brake light works.

[GasWorksGarage]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

..

is it the same as a 55?

[GasWorksGarage]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

..

Thanks mongocanfly for posting! I appreciate it.

[mongocanfly]

I have to back up here..that diagram is for 47-55.1..... I missed where you said 58 in your 1st post..(bad eyes)..I thought it said 53...sorry..I have no idea if any of it is the same..

[1project2many]

Originally Posted by GasWorksGarage

is it the same as a 55?

You can view the 1955 shop manual here: http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com...uck2/index.htm . The '58 and '55 wiring are very close WRT the turn, brake, and tail lights.

If a tail or brake light on a dual filament bulb like the 1157 has a poor ground, power will will travel through both filaments in the light to find a path to ground in another bulb. Based on your description of the rear lights and turn signals I belive the bright rear light is indicating a faulty ground for the LH bulb. I would improve the ground for LH tail / turn lamp. I would also check the LH ground at the same time.

When selecting high beam, do the headlights appear to turn off or do low beams stay operative? Does the high beam indicator in the cluster illuminate? If the lights turn out and the red high beam indicator does not light I would test the dimmer switch for proper operation then, if the switch tests ok, I would test the wires at the headlamps for power during high beam. If you have power at the high beam connector but the lights are still inoperative, check your grounds at the headlamps.

Note that it's possible for sockets to be corroded, crimped terminals to get corroded, and for paint to interfere with circuits. Often the best way to check for a ground is to connect a test lamp between known good ground and the base of a bulb. If the light illuminates when power is pplied to the bulb you can bet that you have resistance in the ground side.

[GasWorksGarage]

I will double check grounds. The headlights go out but the hi beam indicator comes on.

[GasWorksGarage]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

I have to back up here..that diagram is for 47-55.1..... I missed where you said 58 in your 1st post..(bad eyes)..I thought it said 53...sorry..I have no idea if any of it is the same..

It's all good I still appreciate you trying to help. I appreciate all the help thanks all

[Foot Stomper]

Originally Posted by GasWorksGarage

Looking for a wiring diagram for a 58 Apache Cameo 6 cylinder.

Thanks in advance!

Check your messages. I have a wiring diagram I can send if you send me an email.

[_Ogre]

Originally Posted by GasWorksGarage

ok well here goes,
headlights off - right signal on - only right front flashes - left signal on- left front and both rears flash.

headlights on - front marker and low beams work- no hi beam.
rear lights - left very dim right very bright like brake light.

thoughts?

all this indicates bad grounds everywhere. what happens is your grounding thru a bulb to it's ground.

right signal on right front flashes - right rear no flash just very dim.

left signal on left front very slow flash - left rear no flash very bright.

is this a newer problem? did you change anything prior to this problem? did you just change to led bulbs

[_Ogre]

Originally Posted by GasWorksGarage

yes they seem good. I took the off and cleaned them.

where is the main ground? to the motor? add a ground to the body

[dsraven]

ok, before you drive yourself crazy with wiring. start from the beginning instead of trying the short cut long way around. check all the lights to make sure they have the right bulb holders for what you need. if running a dual filament bulb then the pigtail in the lamp needs to have 2 wires in it and the bulb holder needs to have a ground wire coming off it that goes to a good clean dedicated ground connection. if the bulb holder is welded or rivetted to the lamp housing for a ground then check the integrity of the connections there and also ensure the lamp has a good ground or simply run a ground wire in your harness to the lamp and make a good connection inside the lamp for your dedicated ground for that lamp. star washers are commonly used under a ground connection. I like to paint them after with some zinc primer or use some connection grease after I know everything works like ti should.

battery negative. should have a good clean ground terminal connection on the battery and cable. don't rely on a connection that looks good from the outside of the terminal or assume that because the battery and termianls are new that you shouldn't need to clean them. actually take the terminal lug off the post, clean it to bare metal as well as the post, then assemble the parts. check to ensure the cable also has a good clean crimp or joint there as well, inside the terminal, and that the cable is smooth with no lumps indicating corrosion inside the cable. a lot of problems stem from bad grounds. you can have the best gold plated doodads on the positive terminal but a circuit is only as good as it's weakest link. power is like water, it will take the path of least resistance but if there is no path stuff just don't work.
the ground also needs a pathway or a connection to the body, frame and engine so if the positive side is getting gold plated doodads then the negative side should be treated the same
the rad support should have a good clean ground connection to the frame because the front lights and horn are likely grounded on the rad support unless you wire it differently. remember that the ground wire carries the load of both marker and signal circuits so size the ground wire according to the circuit needs.
the rear lights should have a good clean ground connection to the frame rather than to the lamp which is mounted to the box because that eliminates a whole lot of connection resistance between the lamp, box and frame.
the lights all need to have a good clean dedicated ground wire from each bulb holder. some manufacturers like to use a pop rivet on the painted light housing as a ground and that is usually a problem area sooner or later.

what I have done in the past is use some cheap trailer lights when doing wiring. I can clamp them on anywhere for good visibility from the cab where the wiring is being done and then when they power up it is easy to see them. run some good grounds and connections on each one so you KNOW the problem will not be from a poor light connection, even though they are temporary. do the wiring and related tests before connecting the new wiring to the final set of lights you will use on the truck and run all the lights at the same time so you know they all work together. another thing I have done before is use an audible device so I can hear the circuit when it gets powered up, that way if my head is under the dash there is less moving up and down to see what is lighting up out back/front. an old seat belt buzzer would work even.

if you rely on the ground from the battery to be bolted to a fender or inner fender to light up the headlights, horn and signals etc then you are assuming all the body parts are connecting on nice clean bare steel so no voltage drops could occur. when the old trucks get redone we usually take pride in painting everything because we have spent hours repairing the rust from an unpainted surface. then we mount stuff on the paint and don't wanna scrub off any new paint to make a ground connection or we bolt the fenders etc all together and don't even think about how it would conduct electricity afterward, we just bolt on some lights and expect them to work. usually that means a bad ground will show up soon if not right away. a great idea is to run a dedicated ground wire from every bulb socket or accy to a good clean ground to eliminate the unsightly ground screws on new paint but also to ensure each circuit has a dedicated ground that doesn't rely on how tight we cinch down the bolts on the new tail lights or whatever. I also like to use bolts with nuts rather than screws for the ground wires. I find screws tend to work loose or corrode faster than a bolt and nut would. I clean the connection spot down to bare steel, do the connection, test the lights when done and then spray paint over the bare spot or use connection grease on interior grounds where overspray would be an issue. I have also used the aviation form a gasket on these spots because it sticks like crazy and forms a corrosion free cover over the spot. keep the air out and the corrosion will stay out too.
in the dash ensure to run a dedicated ground from each accy or gauge to a common ground spot. don't rely on the dash panel to supply a good ground in these old trucks. I once rewired a burned out motorhome dash and firewall. I used a ground terminal lug under the dash with a cable that ran to the battery. it worked like a bus bar with all the grounds terminating on the single lug. no voltage drops. the volt gauge didn't blip every time the signals blinked etc.

https://www.amazon.ca/MGI-SpeedWare-...TZR0DNV12H04QM


just as a refresher
front marker lights and rear marker lights are separate circuits on lots of systems
front and rear signals are separate circuits because the rears are also the brake lights.
rear signals get power from the flasher unit which gets fused power when the ign is on. brake light switch output also goes to the signal switch . so brake light switch gets fused power first and from there the wire runs up to the signal switch which does the circuit switching for you internally. at the signal switch the circuit divides inside the switch to go to the right or left signal/brake light. with the signals off the power goes from the brake light switch through the signal switch and comes out to each brake light bulb. when the signals turn on the signal switch stops brake light power from that side selected and uses the power coming from the signal flasher instead for that selected side. it's all done for you if it gets wired correctly. interior lights are usually wired as a fused hot at all times to the bulb and the ground wire goes to the headlight and door switches for a ground. dash lights get wired through the rheostat in the headlight switch so they can get variable voltage for dimming.
hope that helped somebody

[GasWorksGarage]

dsraven

your post was both help full and informative. Thank you. I have most of the problems fixed. I have power going into the dimmer and power out both high and low beam. but only low beams work. Got tired of trying to find a schematic
so I broke down ordered a manual.

Thanks all!! Great group honestly!

[mr48chev]

I didn't look into any costs but you might check this out. https://58classicchevy.com/1958-chev...iring-diagrams

It seems it will let you view or download it without a fee. That is very generous of him. You can expand the image and right click on it and save it to your computer in documents real easy. That makes it easy to print off a copy or two to take out to the truck.

[mr48chev]

I saved a copy of the 6 cyl version to my laptop to see how it worked and would have to say that every 58/59 truck owner on here needs to save it for future reference. You can expand what ever part of the saved copy to see the details if your eyes don't do fine print.

[dsraven]

if you have power out of the dimmer on both circuits, separately I assume like not at the same time so low beam is powered when called for but high beam is not powered when the low beam is called for. if both are powered up at the hi/lo switch at the same time then go and unplug the headlights and retest the circuits coming out of the hi/lo switch. if it is normal now with the headlights unplugged, only one of the circuits powered at a time, then the problem seems to be a bad ground at the headlights which is back feeding through the headlight elements in an effort to find a ground. with that sorted out go to the actual headlights, unplug them both, so no chance of a bad circuit in one side contaminating the test results from the other side, and see if you have power there for each circuit. turn the lights on, without the headlights connected at the plug ins, then take your test light and ensure your tester is working by grounding the test light to something that is an actual good ground, don't rely on the ground at the headlight plug, then test the test light's operation by testing something that you know has battery voltage, like the battery if your tester cord is long enough. if that is good you know the tester works now. try each connection on your headlight plug. one should be hot since your headlights are turned on. make a mark on the plug or a quick paper diagram of which connection that is. now go switch the hi-low switch to the other position and go back to the headlight plug to test for power. a different terminal should light up the tester and the previous one should show no power. since there are 3 connectors on the plug it would make sense that the last terminal is the ground. a simple test for that is a reverse check where the tester is powered and you look to see the tester light up when you touch the ground terminal of the plug. if good try a different load on the circuit instead of the tester or a headlight. use a set of jumper wires so you provide the ground separate from the ground in the headlight plug. this is because sometimes a circuit will light up a circuit tester but a bad connection in the circuit won't allow enough amperage to light up the actual headlight light. or, your high beam is powered to the headlight but can't find a ground so the power is going through the elements inside the headlight, which share the ground, and back out the low beam circuit where it finds a ground somewhere in the lighting system. sometimes when the lights are switched on and you have a bad ground scenario you will see a turn indicator light up on the dash even though the signals are off. that is because the system can't find a ground at a marker light so the power goes through the bulb elements and back out through another circuit, like the signals, and then finds a small ground in the dash light bulb. that bulb can't supply enough ground for the system so nothing else lights up except for the dash light. you will also see the marker light goes out when the signals are called for because now the bulb is powered up from both circuits but there is no ground so the bulb stays out.
the other thing I have seen over the years is the little plastic or fibre washer under the bulb, where the contacts are and the wiring comes through the bulb holder, has an index bump or slot in it so the bulb contacts will line up with the contacts in the bulb holder. if the index mark gets sheared off or disintegrates then the indexing is not the same anymore and the washer is allowed to slip or rotate so the bulb and the wiring don't line up/connect like they should. sometimes this can make both circuits power up when only one circuit is actually turned on. on some repairs I will go around and remove bulbs to ensure the washer under it is properly indexing and also the previous guy installed the correct bulb. I have seen a dual element bulb be replaced with a single element bulb by accident because the bulb was packaged wrong or in the wrong parts bin etc. it can really mess you around. if testing for a bad ground at a light turn the lights on and touch the test light probe to the bulb socket. if the test light comes on then there is no ground on the bulb socket so power is going through the bulb to the holder and powering the bulb holder.
hopefully that all made sense to somebody. lol.

[mr48chev]

I rather have the feeling that GasWorksGarage is in the process of straightening out someone else's mess which often is worse than starting from scratch.

The "what did they cut an splice rather than disconnect correctly when they pulled the ______ is often an issue.

First job I had in a real shop as a mechanic I replaced a kid who had lasted an hour and a half before being fired. He had got to know the boss while working in a wrecking yard that the boss frequented and hung around a bit at the races where the boss an his son ran dirt track modified. My boss was in his 60's then.
Any how first day on the job the boss asked him to pull the engine out of a car that was in for an engine overhaul. 20 minutes later he was back saying that he had the engine out. After a "wow that was fast" they looked and he had cut every line and wire just as he had done on hundreds in the wrecking yard and had torched the exhast pipes in two. It took me three weeks to patch that car back together including several trips to wrecking yards to get decent sections of wiring harness that was uncut and installing a new exhaust pipe. The kid went back to the wrecking yard, got his old job back and as far as I know probably spent the rest of his life working in that wrecking yard.