Front suspension and steering questions - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

Asshat · 01-10-2021, 04:41 PM

I finished the rear end swap and noticed it drives much better, however, all the little bumps in the road really create a jarring experience. Like all the reflectors in the road, just driving over them, you can feel every single one. Would new springs help with this? I just installed new shocks all the way around.

Also, looking at converting to power steering; the steering box is a bit loose. Defintiely want to tighten that up. And I want a closer ration on the turns.

Not sure if those kits for $700-$800 are worth it. There are cheaper alternatives, right?

On the 63 pickups, they only had steering assist, correct? Is it better to just add the original steering assist or go with full power steering?

Asshat · 01-10-2021, 05:14 PM

The truck sits pretty nice, I think. A while back, I was thinking about dropping it a couple of inches.

If I do buy new springs, you think I should go with 2” lower front and rear?

**The Rocknrod** · 01-10-2021, 05:36 PM

You could get captainfabs adapter and a steering box - http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboa...d.php?t=332923

Asshat · 01-10-2021, 06:11 PM

Is it possible to just buy all these components from Rock Auto, let's say for a 1974 C10?

- Gear box (3-1/4 turns)
- Pressure hose
- Return hose
- Gear nut
- Pitman arm
- Pump
- Pulley
- Pump bracket
- Steering coupler?
- Tie rod end?

**The Rocknrod** · 01-10-2021, 06:41 PM

You need his bracket, but the rest of the items yes if the brackets fit your water pump length ect.

**jayoldschool** · 01-10-2021, 08:05 PM

It's a C20, much stiffer ride than a 10. The difference between my 65 C10 and buddy's 63 C20 was amazing, that thing rode like a school bus. If you want it to ride smooth, you need some weight in the back. Or, convert it to C10 specs.

**PGSigns** · 01-10-2021, 08:07 PM

The C20's are sprung a bit stiff. But they were designed that way to be able to carry a load. You can put C10 springs front and rear and that will soften the ride. You can lower the tire pressure a bit and that also helps.
Jimmy

66x3 · 01-10-2021, 08:12 PM

Might have to look pretty hard for six cyl brackets for p/steering pump, good luck. My vote is to keep your stock springs. I like our C20s to look like the heavier duty trucks that they are.

**cwcarpenter98** · 01-10-2021, 10:14 PM

You have a 292 right?
If you aren't set on getting factory power steering brackets, there's at least one company out there that makes them. I got this link from another post on here awhile back: https://davisspeedequipment.com/

If you go with the 74 or so steering gear, you'll need a bracket that mounts the power gear to your manual steering frame. I think Captainfab's bracket will work for you if you choose to go that route (check with him on it since your needs are for a c20). Also a good time to install a collapsible intermediate steering shaft.

Like mentioned above, you could install 1/2 ton springs fairly easily. Maybe see if someone local is giving away a set of stock springs, install those, see how you like the ride, then if you decide you want to lower it, you can. I could be wrong, but I'm thinking the 1/2 ton springs might lower it a little in comparison to the stock 3/4 ton springs

J Williams · 01-10-2021, 10:38 PM

As mentioned above, captainfab adapter plate then a steering box from a 72-74 I know will work. Probably even up to 78. I also used the power steering pump out of the 72. Everything bolted up easily other than the pulley wouldn't line up. I ended up buying a complete pulley setup that changed everything on the engine and now it lines up perfect. Just couldn't find one that matched what I had. I had a donor truck so parts were free. You will also have a steering shaft issue. Right now I have one I welded up on as a mock up but would suggest getting a collapsible one so if the unmentionable happens you don't eat a steering wheel.

AcampoDave · 01-11-2021, 01:55 AM

Check your cab mount cushions. If they are all shot out a new set of rubber ones will help a little too.
I got these https://www.classicparts.com/1963-66...oaAo_YEALw_wcB

val1gonzales · 01-11-2021, 03:44 AM

What I did was go out to a local junkyard and found everything I needed and got it all for $165. I found a '70 C10 shell with only block and PS pump and sector in it. I had to take it all off myself but it was all good! I kept every bolt, washer, clamp, bracket, pulley and even the original used pump and hoses for good measure. Most junkyards just need to sell and not worried about what they cost on eBay or new. To them its money for parts. Then some elbow grease, spray paint, some new service parts and it's like new. Once in it looks like it was factory.

SCOTI · 01-11-2021, 10:55 AM

What tires are you running? Heavy Duty tires vs standard car/truck tires make an impact on the ride quality. 8-ply tires will definitely transmit more road surface 'feel' into the chassis @ their recommended max pressures for the loads they're able to haul.

Tire selection & air pressures can make a big difference here.

Coil spring rates will vary between a C10 & C20 but may not be that different. Without knowing what you have, swapping in new springs may not yield much difference.

If doing a steering swap, the Captain Fab bracket & full power steering would be the direction I'd go....

Asshat · 01-17-2021, 07:49 PM

Not sure why, but the truck is leaning to one side.
Any ideas?
Edit: 1-1/2” lower on the driver side.

SCOTI · 01-17-2021, 08:06 PM

Coils not seated the same. One maybe didn't seat correctly or could the be clocked differently?

Was the truck level/equal before changes were made?

Asshat · 01-17-2021, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Coils not seated the same. One maybe didn't seat correctly or could the be clocked differently?

Was the truck level/equal before changes were made?

I didn’t make any changes to the front, just the rear. And, I did not change the rear springs, just removed the upper mounts and re-installed.

Edit: 1-1/2” lower on the driver side.

kaycee · 01-17-2021, 10:03 PM

Maybe you need a add a leaf/spring ,found this in my 63 I purchased

Asshat · 01-17-2021, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaycee

Maybe you need a add a leaf/spring ,found this in my 63 I purchased

I wonder if one spring in the rear could cause the entire vehicle to lean to one side.

kaycee · 01-17-2021, 10:06 PM

ADD A Leaf/spring .I found this today while bleeding brakes

Asshat · 01-17-2021, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaycee

ADD A Leaf/spring .I found this today while bleeding brakes

I don't think this is a good solution.

**Steeveedee** · 01-17-2021, 11:01 PM

What is the expected end use for your truck? That may help us help you on deciding what to do.

I think that maybe the 3/4T is more than you expected, in a number of ways. Without discussing how it leans, etc., maybe you should consider a trade for a 1/2T? My 3/4T truck rides like a...truck, even with the camper shell on it, and actually not much better when towing a 6k pound travel trailer. 3/4T trucks ride like they do for a reason. I'm suspecting that you are used to newer vehicle ride quality and expect to achieve that. I guarantee that you will never achieve that newer vehicle ride quality. Not trying to be difficult, just giving some opinions. FWIW, one of my sons bought a new Canyon pickup last week. I consider the suspension to be "spongy". I used to race on mountain roads (don't tell my mom) and had made serious upgrades to suspensions on those cars. Soft wasn't a word for those rides.

Asshat · 01-17-2021, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steeveedee

What is the expected end use for your truck? That may help us help you on deciding what to do.

I think that maybe the 3/4T is more than you expected, in a number of ways. Without discussing how it leans, etc., maybe you should consider a trade for a 1/2T? My 3/4T truck rides like a...truck, even with the camper shell on it, and actually not much better when towing a 6k pound travel trailer. 3/4T trucks ride like they do for a reason. I'm suspecting that you are used to newer vehicle ride quality and expect to achieve that. I guarantee that you will never achieve that newer vehicle ride quality. Not trying to be difficult, just giving some opinions. FWIW, one of my sons bought a new Canyon pickup last week. I consider the suspension to be "spongy". I used to race on mountain roads (don't tell my mom) and had made serious upgrades to suspensions on those cars. Soft wasn't a word for those rides.

I know this is an old truck, so I am not concerned that the it is not comfortable.

I'm trying to determine how to make the truck sit level, and not lean to one side.

AcampoDave · 01-18-2021, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asshat

I wonder if one spring in the rear could cause the entire vehicle to lean to one side.

In my experience, yes.

SCOTI · 01-18-2021, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

In my experience, yes.

Yes. One corner being different/off can cause the entire vehicle to shift. It will/can be more exaggerated depending on the position relative to the issue.

bigmoe · 01-18-2021, 10:28 AM

When you have a lean like that it could be caused by the front or back springs. What you can do is, with the truck on a level surface, put the front frame level on jack stands and see if the rear if off. Then do the same thing with the rear frame on jack stands to see if it's the front where the problem is.

01-10-2021, 04:41 PM	#1
Asshat Registered User Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Orange County CA Posts: 1,265	Front suspension and steering questions I finished the rear end swap and noticed it drives much better, however, all the little bumps in the road really create a jarring experience. Like all the reflectors in the road, just driving over them, you can feel every single one. Would new springs help with this? I just installed new shocks all the way around. Also, looking at converting to power steering; the steering box is a bit loose. Defintiely want to tighten that up. And I want a closer ration on the turns. Not sure if those kits for $700-$800 are worth it. There are cheaper alternatives, right? On the 63 pickups, they only had steering assist, correct? Is it better to just add the original steering assist or go with full power steering? __________________ 1963 C20, small window, long bed 292, 4-speed

01-10-2021, 05:14 PM	#2
Asshat Registered User Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Orange County CA Posts: 1,265	Re: Front suspension and steering questions The truck sits pretty nice, I think. A while back, I was thinking about dropping it a couple of inches. If I do buy new springs, you think I should go with 2” lower front and rear? Attached Images __________________ 1963 C20, small window, long bed 292, 4-speed

01-10-2021, 05:36 PM	#3
The Rocknrod Moderator Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: China Spring, TX Posts: 7,280	Re: Front suspension and steering questions You could get captainfabs adapter and a steering box - http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboa...d.php?t=332923 __________________ Master Chief, US Navy, Retired 1964 C10 Step-side Short Bed - In Progress 2009 2500HD Duramax LTZ 1948 GMC Panel 1956 Big Window Stepside 1953 5 Window Chevy Stepside 1932 Coupe New Seat Foam for Bench Seats?

01-10-2021, 06:11 PM	#4
Asshat Registered User Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Orange County CA Posts: 1,265	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Is it possible to just buy all these components from Rock Auto, let's say for a 1974 C10? - Gear box (3-1/4 turns) - Pressure hose - Return hose - Gear nut - Pitman arm - Pump - Pulley - Pump bracket - Steering coupler? - Tie rod end? __________________ 1963 C20, small window, long bed 292, 4-speed

01-10-2021, 06:41 PM	#5
The Rocknrod Moderator Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: China Spring, TX Posts: 7,280	Re: Front suspension and steering questions You need his bracket, but the rest of the items yes if the brackets fit your water pump length ect. __________________ Master Chief, US Navy, Retired 1964 C10 Step-side Short Bed - In Progress 2009 2500HD Duramax LTZ 1948 GMC Panel 1956 Big Window Stepside 1953 5 Window Chevy Stepside 1932 Coupe New Seat Foam for Bench Seats?

01-10-2021, 08:05 PM	#6
jayoldschool Moderator Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: ON, Canada Posts: 2,176	Re: Front suspension and steering questions It's a C20, much stiffer ride than a 10. The difference between my 65 C10 and buddy's 63 C20 was amazing, that thing rode like a school bus. If you want it to ride smooth, you need some weight in the back. Or, convert it to C10 specs.

01-10-2021, 08:07 PM	#7
PGSigns Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Hayes Va Posts: 4,569	Re: Front suspension and steering questions The C20's are sprung a bit stiff. But they were designed that way to be able to carry a load. You can put C10 springs front and rear and that will soften the ride. You can lower the tire pressure a bit and that also helps. Jimmy __________________ 60 to 66 Chevy and GMC window decals http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=661131 Good friends, good food and a hotrod what else do you need? 1966 BBW long fleet Daily driver 1965 BBW short fleet Sold and going to a good home 1965 Suburban 2003 3500 Duramax 2005 Ultra Classic

01-10-2021, 08:12 PM	#8
66x3 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: Bellevue, MI Posts: 118	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Might have to look pretty hard for six cyl brackets for p/steering pump, good luck. My vote is to keep your stock springs. I like our C20s to look like the heavier duty trucks that they are.

01-10-2021, 10:14 PM	#9
cwcarpenter98 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: Hickory Flat, GA Posts: 4,488	Re: Front suspension and steering questions You have a 292 right? If you aren't set on getting factory power steering brackets, there's at least one company out there that makes them. I got this link from another post on here awhile back: https://davisspeedequipment.com/ If you go with the 74 or so steering gear, you'll need a bracket that mounts the power gear to your manual steering frame. I think Captainfab's bracket will work for you if you choose to go that route (check with him on it since your needs are for a c20). Also a good time to install a collapsible intermediate steering shaft. Like mentioned above, you could install 1/2 ton springs fairly easily. Maybe see if someone local is giving away a set of stock springs, install those, see how you like the ride, then if you decide you want to lower it, you can. I could be wrong, but I'm thinking the 1/2 ton springs might lower it a little in comparison to the stock 3/4 ton springs __________________ Christian Carpenter 1963 C10 - Frankentruck 283, Muncie 3 speed with overdrive Overdrive wiring here 1963-ish truck bed trailer - Half-Wit 1981 C10 - Penny 305, th350 --> Soon to be 350, Saginaw 4 speed 1995 Dodge Dakota Sport "I'll put it simple: if you're going hard enough left, you'll find yourself turning right." - Doc Hudson

01-10-2021, 10:38 PM	#10
J Williams Registered User Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Paul idaho Posts: 263	Re: Front suspension and steering questions As mentioned above, captainfab adapter plate then a steering box from a 72-74 I know will work. Probably even up to 78. I also used the power steering pump out of the 72. Everything bolted up easily other than the pulley wouldn't line up. I ended up buying a complete pulley setup that changed everything on the engine and now it lines up perfect. Just couldn't find one that matched what I had. I had a donor truck so parts were free. You will also have a steering shaft issue. Right now I have one I welded up on as a mock up but would suggest getting a collapsible one so if the unmentionable happens you don't eat a steering wheel. __________________ 63 C10

01-11-2021, 01:55 AM	#11
AcampoDave Registered User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: central California Posts: 2,776	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Check your cab mount cushions. If they are all shot out a new set of rubber ones will help a little too. I got these https://www.classicparts.com/1963-66...oaAo_YEALw_wcB

01-11-2021, 03:44 AM	#12
val1gonzales Registered User Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: San Antonio Posts: 124	Re: Front suspension and steering questions What I did was go out to a local junkyard and found everything I needed and got it all for $165. I found a '70 C10 shell with only block and PS pump and sector in it. I had to take it all off myself but it was all good! I kept every bolt, washer, clamp, bracket, pulley and even the original used pump and hoses for good measure. Most junkyards just need to sell and not worried about what they cost on eBay or new. To them its money for parts. Then some elbow grease, spray paint, some new service parts and it's like new. Once in it looks like it was factory. Attached Images

01-11-2021, 10:55 AM	#13
SCOTI Registered User Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: DALLAS,TX Posts: 22,066	Re: Front suspension and steering questions What tires are you running? Heavy Duty tires vs standard car/truck tires make an impact on the ride quality. 8-ply tires will definitely transmit more road surface 'feel' into the chassis @ their recommended max pressures for the loads they're able to haul. Tire selection & air pressures can make a big difference here. Coil spring rates will vary between a C10 & C20 but may not be that different. Without knowing what you have, swapping in new springs may not yield much difference. If doing a steering swap, the Captain Fab bracket & full power steering would be the direction I'd go.... __________________ 67SWB-B.B.RetroRod 64SWB-Recycle 89CCDually-Driver/Tow Truck 99CCSWB Driver All Fleetsides @rattlecankustoms in IG Building a small, high rpm engine with the perfect bore, stroke and rod ratio is very impressive. It's like a highly skilled Morrocan sword fighter with a Damascus Steel Scimitar..... *Cubic inches is like Indiana Jones with a cheap pistol.*

01-17-2021, 07:49 PM	#14
Asshat Registered User Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Orange County CA Posts: 1,265	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Not sure why, but the truck is leaning to one side. Any ideas? Edit: 1-1/2” lower on the driver side. Attached Images __________________ 1963 C20, small window, long bed 292, 4-speed Last edited by Asshat; 01-17-2021 at 10:02 PM.

01-17-2021, 08:06 PM	#15
SCOTI Registered User Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: DALLAS,TX Posts: 22,066	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Coils not seated the same. One maybe didn't seat correctly or could the be clocked differently? Was the truck level/equal before changes were made? __________________ 67SWB-B.B.RetroRod 64SWB-Recycle 89CCDually-Driver/Tow Truck 99CCSWB Driver All Fleetsides @rattlecankustoms in IG Building a small, high rpm engine with the perfect bore, stroke and rod ratio is very impressive. It's like a highly skilled Morrocan sword fighter with a Damascus Steel Scimitar..... *Cubic inches is like Indiana Jones with a cheap pistol.*



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01-17-2021, 10:03 PM	#17
kaycee Registered User Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Wyoming USA Posts: 2,449	Re: Front suspension and steering questions Maybe you need a add a leaf/spring ,found this in my 63 I purchased __________________ 2001 Silverado K-1500 2005 FXDWG stage3 69 CHEVY Short/Step 327/4L60 373 posi 63 IMPALA 327

01-17-2021, 10:06 PM	#19
kaycee Registered User Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Wyoming USA Posts: 2,449	Re: Front suspension and steering questions ADD A Leaf/spring .I found this today while bleeding brakes Attached Images __________________ 2001 Silverado K-1500 2005 FXDWG stage3 69 CHEVY Short/Step 327/4L60 373 posi 63 IMPALA 327

01-17-2021, 11:01 PM	#21
Steeveedee Who Changed This? Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Simi Valley, CA Posts: 10,692	Re: Front suspension and steering questions What is the expected end use for your truck? That may help us help you on deciding what to do. I think that maybe the 3/4T is more than you expected, in a number of ways. Without discussing how it leans, etc., maybe you should consider a trade for a 1/2T? My 3/4T truck rides like a...truck, even with the camper shell on it, and actually not much better when towing a 6k pound travel trailer. 3/4T trucks ride like they do for a reason. I'm suspecting that you are used to newer vehicle ride quality and expect to achieve that. I guarantee that you will never achieve that newer vehicle ride quality. Not trying to be difficult, just giving some opinions. FWIW, one of my sons bought a new Canyon pickup last week. I consider the suspension to be "spongy". I used to race on mountain roads (don't tell my mom) and had made serious upgrades to suspensions on those cars. Soft wasn't a word for those rides. __________________ ~Steven '70 Chevy 3/4T Longhorn CST 402/400/3.56 Custom Camper Simi Valley, CA

01-18-2021, 10:28 AM	#25
bigmoe Registered User Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Brandon, Manitoba, Canada Posts: 995	Re: Front suspension and steering questions When you have a lean like that it could be caused by the front or back springs. What you can do is, with the truck on a level surface, put the front frame level on jack stands and see if the rear if off. Then do the same thing with the rear frame on jack stands to see if it's the front where the problem is.

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